Arrow fletches

[Archeress]

QUESTION....yeah i should know this...
Hi all..I am delving into the world of 3DAAA seing as i had so much fun at coal creek.

A 70 pound elm bow that i will be using for 3DAAA needs feathers of......???????? 4 inch?..5 inch?..i am using 11/32 shafts with 125 gr field points...anyone feel free to advise.

cheers kelly

[bigbob]

cant help with 3dAAA but ABA would require a minimum of 12'' of feathers all up ie, 3x 4''.There will be others who will give the right answer for you before long.

[Stickbow Hunter]

Don't know what any shoot rule requirements are but with your set up I would use 3 x 5" feathers.

Jeff

[Archeress]

Sounds about right Jeff...i meant to say ABA shoots. just had 3daaa on my mind when typing.
I had loads of fun and some very awful shooting at coal creek on the sunday. So i will contact sunshine coast bowmen next week and find out what my shoot requirements are.

[bigbob]

I'm an ex member of said club, and they will certainly be able to give you any advice, but as far as I know all that's required by ABA is a minimum of 12'' of feathers. But as Jeff said it would be better to go with the 3 x 5'' feathers as they would provide more stability given the poundage involved.Cheers.

[Archeress]

thankyou bob

[greybeard]

Hi Archeress,

3DAAA Rules

Click on the link for the for the rule book.

http://www.3daaa.com/index.php/3daaa_rules/

Extract;

MAXIMUM DRAW WEIGHT
The maximum draw weight for each class shall be as follows:
B.1.1 Cub Classes = 40 pounds.
B.1.2 All Female and Youth Classes = 60 pounds.
B.1.3 All Male and Traditional Class = 80 pounds.
A two (2) pound variation will be allowed.

They do not mention at what draw length.

Traditional (TRAD)
A recurve or longbow without a sighting device. Arrow should be shot from the shelf or
hand with no elevated rest. Only a piece of leather or similar material 1/8 inch thick or
less shall be allowed on the arrow shelf. There will be no markings on the bow or on the
bowstring that could be construed as sighting marks. There will not be any type of draw
check on the bow or string. There shall be a single (1) nocking point on the string, i.e.
this single (1) nocking point may have two (2) nock point indicators on the string between
which the arrow is nocked on the string. Must be shot with a glove, finger tab or bare
fingers. No stabilisers or counter balances shall be allowed. The use of clickers, draw
checks, mechanical or electronic devices shall be prohibited as a shooting aid. While
shooting, the archer shall touch the arrow with the index finger against the nock, and
using a single anchor point. Aluminum or carbon arrows must have screw-in field points;
wood arrows may have glue-on points. All arrows must have at least three (3) feathers or
vanes no less than four (4) inches long. No stabilizers, counterbalances, or weights of
any kind may be attached or built into the bow, except a quiver clearly designed to hold
arrows. Arrows shall be shot off the hand or shelf of the riser only. An arrow side plate (if
used) may only extend one (1) inch above the arrow. Must be shot from the WHITE
stake; maximum of 30 yards.
NOTE: STRING WALKING & FACE WALKING ARE NOT ALLOWED IN THIS CLASS.

Daryl.

[perry]

Archeress, forgive me I'm off on a Tangent [ read Rant ] as I see a deeper point needs to be made about Fletching than just meeting the Rules - unless your Arrows are perfectly matched to your Selfbow you are going to require a little more Fletch than 3 x 4" and perhaps 3 x 5" Fletches which is what I think Jeff was eluding too. In my experience particularly with Selfbows it is not the length that will give your Fletches the best ability to Stabilize the Arrow in Flight but the Height. I have never seen a commercially cut Fletch that has adequite Height. You can buy Feather Choppers that do cut Fletches of Adequite Height but I mainly use a homemade Template and a pair of Scissors

By way of example, check out those silly little Vanes that Compound Shooters use, note the moulded lines or Bumps that flow down their length and how they are cut a little higher, both designed to increase surface area. A great many Trad Archery developments have been adapted to modern materials, they owe us a great debt.

I have shot my perfectly spined Arrows from my properly tuned Selfbow in Rain heavy enough to lay the Fletch down on the Shaft so that it provided little stabilisation other than the mass on the end of the Arrow in 3DAAA Comp and still acheived better Arrow Flight than many Trad Archers I saw at the recent North Albert Trad Shoot did on a fine day. Arrows are key to shooting accurately and a great many Trad Archers just do not get that and concentrate on a Shiny Colourful Bow

I cut my own Fletches to around 4.5" long and 6/8" or 7/8" of an inch high for maximum surface Area, gives me a nice compromise in Length / Height and does not create so much Drag my Arrows fall from the Sky and in combination with properly spined Arrows come out of Paradox quickly.

If you are the lady I remember meeting some time ago at the Corival I think you had medievil reproduction Arrows with quite long classically handcut Fletches ?? they would have plenty of surface area and meet the requirements of both Organisations

If you are limited to commercial cut Fletching with a new set of Arrows 4 x 4" commercial cut Fletching gives very good surface area and will pull an arrow out of paradox faster than 3 x 5" Feathers will

regards Jacko

[Archeress]

thanks guys...ideas and concepts well noted...one thing i was concerned about regarding historical bows..which is what i may shoot under ...is that i read that no marks to be on the bow to give the archer a guide to distance...lol well this bow looks like a branch that has come right off an elm tree. marks and spots and lines all up and down. i will have to post a photo.....if it turns out i cannot use it for whatever reasons then i will be happy to use my 60 pound horsebow.

[perry]

I would not worry about natural lumps and bumps on the Bow Archeress, they are not going to pick on them. They do look for lines etc in Camo patterns / arrow rests etc that could be used for sight marks. Don't worry about your strike plate, they will not pick on it as able to be used for reference provided it does not have bars and lines printed on it. Watch Cresting though as some clever Folks have worked out where to place Cresting Bars and use them as reference points and they have regulated that.

I disagree stongly with some of the Rules in the Classic Bow Division and have spent a fair amount of time and effort in years past to get them to wake up to themselves that Self Nocks are not Dangerous, that Historic String Materials are just as strong and reliable as modern String Materials and for goodness Sake allowing modern Glues only to assemble your Arrows - With any luck they have seen sence and changed the Rules, have not checked in years as I lost interest in ABA / IFAA Competition

regards Jacko

[Dennis La Varenne]

Archeress,

VERY interested to see a good pic of your Elm bow.

[Archeress]

hi Dennis...always difficult to take a singly pic of a long bow if one wants a bit of detail..so i will endeavour to take a single shot and then take section close up shots..bit by bit .

[Archeress]

As you can see it has a load of natural marks on it.

[Archeress]

[Archeress]

This is the belly..

[Archeress]

i think the other thing i wanted to clarify as i dont know clearly enough about aba or 3daaa and how everything is organised is that my arrows will never ever have plastic nocks on them..I am thinking that if that rules me out then thats ok..i love historical trad and plastic doesnt belong...having said that..yep i am using a fast flight string..
Here are some arrows i am making for the elm bow.

[GrahameA]

i think the other thing i wanted to clarify as i dont know clearly enough about aba or 3daaa and how everything is organised is that my arrows will never ever have plastic nocks on them..I am thinking that if that rules me out then thats ok..i love historical trad and plastic doesnt belong...having said that..yep i am using a fast flight string..

For ABA you should read the notes on historical division - cab downloaded from here http://www.bowhunters.org.au/index.php/ ... t-division as they specify no self-nocks. They also specify B50 for the string.

[Archeress]

5. Arrow shafts shall be made of wood and fletched with natural feather, attached by
historical means. Modern arrow points/piles are permitted as are nocks. Arrow
nocks cut into the shaft are not permitted.

Oh well that lets me out then..i guess i wont be competing as all my arrows have nocks cut into the shafts.

[Dennis La Varenne]

Archeress,

Many thanks for the pics of your Elm bow. I love those 'no handle' circular bending bows. The elegant simplicity of them is what gets me. They are usually easy to make, reliable, simple to tiller and durable . . . and if the tiller happens to change a bit, you can adjust it by simply shifting where you hold it or simply turning it the other way up. Lots of redeeming features.

I have some replica long bows after the style of the Woodland Indians of the Eastern seaboard of the United States. Some of the Cherokee and Penobscot bows were in the 6 foot range but of rectangular cross section. Not many of the bows made by North American Indians had rounded bellies. Most, including the very short bows of the Plains Indians were rectangular in cross section. I have a couple of kits from Rudderbows in the US to make the Penobscot compound bow which is a remarkably sophisticated design. But my first preference and love is for the long circular bending bow of any cross-section like yours.

Any chance of some dimensions and the amount of set it may have taken? It looks to be D-section. Is it? Did you make it? How did you come by the Elm?