Shooting to the left

[Farmgirl]

I'm a newbie, having taken up recurve only a few weeks ago. My accuracy has improved a lot in that time. I have tried to work on correct form and am now reasonably confident that it's a lot better than it was to start with. I have no coach but go to an archery club where you do pick up pointers. I also read as much as I can and my husband helps me out, although he's only a few months ahead of me and also more of a compound shooter.
Anyway, I have noticed that despite what I think is reasonably good posture, I have a tendency to place my arrows left of the bullseye. 9 times out of 10 when I miss it's to the top left.
What could be causing that? I know it's difficult to answer without seeing me shoot.

[Bill]

Without actually being there and checking, do you know which eye is your dominate eye. Taking in account that your set up is all correct, I have a feeling that because your shooting right handed (am I correct in saying that) your left eye is is pulling you to shoot in its alignment. Thus you have a larger majority of your arrows being scored up and to the left. Then again I could be completely wwwwwrrrrooooooooonnnggg so please forgive me, may be someone else can assist, oh! by the way where do you live?. best of luck...........Bill

[Farmgirl]

Hi Bill, I'm in Brisbane. I'll need to put something on the profile.
Thanks for your suggestions. What you brought up is very interesting. I am indeed right handed. Unfortunately my dominant eye is the left one, which means, according to what I have read, that I should be shooting left handed too. There's no way I'm doing that. I would knot myself into a pretzel.
On top of that, I actually shoot with both eyes open anyway. I am much more on target that way. Could this be causing the problem?

[terryzac]

Could be your arrows afre to stiff

[littlejohn59]

hi farmgirl
it is hard to say what is causing your arrows to shoot left without being there. However arrows that are too heavily spined will shoot to the left. ian

[Farmgirl]

I have used a variety of arrows with the same result. However, I'll take your advice, as my form is still changing, my drawlength has changed and therefore my arrows may not be correct either.
Pretty overwhelming stuff when you first start out. But I guess learning and gaining experience is part of the fun.
I should add, just for information sake, that I am instinctive shooting. I presently have two bows. The first one I got is a gorgeous Hoyt Buffalo of 40#. However, in true beginner style, I bit off more than I can chew. So I'm now using a Hoyt Eclipse with a lessor poundage (drawing about 33#) to built up the right muscles. I prefer the Buffalo because I can shoot off the shelf and I seem to shoot better but I can't sustain it too long before I get fatigued. So I use the Eclipse which has a rest.
Sorry to go on and on about my stuff. I'm thinking maybe it can paint a picture of what I'm mucking around with.
Thanks for listening.

[Bent Stick]

Okay draw length, arrow length, point weight, arrow spine?

[Bill]

Farmgirl.............. I've sent you a pm.

[sambar]

hi there i am exactly the same, right handed with left eye dominant and i had the exact same problem as you. It comes down to your dominant eye not being over the arrow you need to close your left eye so you will only have your right open right over the arrow it will restrict you alittle with your field of view and depth perception but i was hitting bunnys at 40 yards doing this with no probs. The only problem i found is that i was truely gap shooting as only having one eye open over the arrow forces you to focus on the arrow tip and not the target, so i had to know the distance i was shooting to be on the money. Dont get me wrong i was just as accurate as i am now maybe even alittle more. Then i took the leap and when too left handed and will never look back as i can shoot both eyes open and shoot instinctive.

[Farmgirl]

Draw length: 25 inches
Field Tip: 70.4 grain
Poundage: pulling 33#
Spine: Easton Carbon 1 with a spine of 810
Overall arrow weight: 242 grain

I also have another set of full metal jackets:
Field Tip: 70.4 grain
Easton navigator FMJ with a spine of 630
Overall weight of arrow: 307 grain

[UPTHETOP]

You say that you shoot the buffalo off the shelf but now shoot the eclipse, you are shooting the eclipse off a raised rest if so try adjusting it back with less space between the guide and the riser. Do this before spending any money on shafts etc.
A tendency new shooters have as well is when building the muscles to to take the poundage you are shooting, their is a tendency to swing the bow a little left on the draw ( from the left arm not being strong enough to hold steady and the shot usualy ends up left and high a little).

When you go to the club next get someone else to shoot your bow and see if it is an arrow to bow tunning fix or is it just a little bit of fixing the form before you pick up any bad habits.
Im shore there will be people willing to help.

Cheers Wayno

[terryzac]

where do you shoot at.

terry

[Farmgirl]

You say that you shoot the buffalo off the shelf but now shoot the eclipse, you are shooting the eclipse off a raised rest if so try adjusting it back with less space between the guide and the riser. Do this before spending any money on shafts etc.
A tendency new shooters have as well is when building the muscles to to take the poundage you are shooting, their is a tendency to swing the bow a little left on the draw ( from the left arm not being strong enough to hold steady and the shot usualy ends up left and high a little).

When you go to the club next get someone else to shoot your bow and see if it is an arrow to bow tunning fix or is it just a little bit of fixing the form before you pick up any bad habits.
Im shore there will be people willing to help.

Cheers Wayno

Actually, what you say makes sense to me. When I first started I became VERY muscle sore. I know bad form was undoubtedly to blame plus higher poundage than I should have used. I'm getting much stronger now and can hold the eclipse without shaking. But I think you might be right about the arm strength. I'll look into what you said about the rest too. Thanks for that.

Terry, do you mean what do I focuse on or what targets do I use? Target wise, I use whatever is handy. We have some standard colorful archery targets, we make up our own with black and white rifle targets, we have some 3D animals and at the club we have the flat animal posters.
In terms of aiming, I focuse hard on the bullseye and am only aware of the arrow "in the back of my mind". Like throwing a ball. I look at the basketball and have only a background sense of where the ball is.

[perry]

G/Day Farmgirl, good to see you posting over here

Could be anything from your Arrow Spine, Bow Centreshot, your grip changing and as you eluded too Fatigue. Not having your Feet, Hips and Shoulders in the same Plane will cause you to shoot left if you are twisted at the Hips. I have also noticed many Women have an Anatomical difference in their Elbows [ their Elbows stick straight out and do not roll vertically ] which can make it difficult to find the right Alignment which will cause Fatigue until they learn to work around it and modify there form. Do you stand side on or with an open stance to the Target, if you change your Stance this will change Arrow Point of Impact.

Andy, I will sort things so I can get down to the Grange this coming Sunday so I can meet you and give you those DVD's I burned for you. I will be very happy to help you with your Form. I won't Nag whats right and wrong, just the fundamentals and help you adapt them to suit your Physique. Once you have reasonable Form you can then keep an Eye on how you are progressing by having Hubby Video you Shooting

regards Jacko

[Farmgirl]

G/Day Farmgirl, good to see you posting over here

Could be anything from your Arrow Spine, Bow Centreshot, your grip changing and as you eluded too Fatigue. Not having your Feet, Hips and Shoulders in the same Plane will cause you to shoot left if you are twisted at the Hips. I have also noticed many Women have an Anatomical difference in their Elbows [ their Elbows stick straight out and do not roll vertically ] which can make it difficult to find the right Alignment which will cause Fatigue until they learn to work around it and modify there form. Do you stand side on or with an open stance to the Target, if you change your Stance this will change Arrow Point of Impact.

Andy, I will sort things so I can get down to the Grange this coming Sunday so I can meet you and give you those DVD's I burned for you. I will be very happy to help you with your Form. I won't Nag whats right and wrong, just the fundamentals and help you adapt them to suit your Physique. Once you have reasonable Form you can then keep an Eye on how you are progressing by having Hubby Video you Shooting

regards Jacko

That would be awesome. There is a 3D comp on this Sunday at the club. My husband and son will be competing. I'll go along too or turn up at whatever time you'll be there.
There are so many factors involved in getting things right. I'm a bit impatient, I like to do well.
I don't have an open stance towards the target. I found that made me shoot left even more. I stand quite square. Anyway, you can critique me at the club. Criticize freely btw. I'm not princessy.

[Nephew]

My personal opinion is don't worry to much about accuracy for now, Farmgirl, just practice getting your form right and later you can work on accuracy. I kinda think accuracy comes once you get to a point where you no longer need to think about shooting, it just kinda happens naturally if all you need to concentrate on is aiming, you know what I mean?
Good luck with it and welcome to the family!

[perry]

I would like to spend the Morning working on my own Form on the practice Range and give you as much help as I can. I have not shot for a few weeks and will be bringing down my Target Bow. If you like Farmgirl I will bring down my Selfbows for you to have a look at also.

Somethings to think about - Hardest lesson in Archery is Patience, to take little steps, work on one aspect of your Form at a time. One day it will "Sort of Click" and you'll be away, those Bunnies won't be safe inside 40 yards. You'll go a long way increasing your confidence by learning not to worry about your last Arrow, its gone and can't be fixed think about making the next Shot as good as it can be and before long good shots will be ingrained. I don't think it a good idea to concern yourself with a Score in Practice but instead record the number of Shots that felt really good - As for Comps regardless of what your Score say's you will know if you shot well and be satisfied with that. Each practice session should be about increasing the % of really good Shots.

regards Jacko

[Farmgirl]

Thanks everybody for your advice and welcoming words. I'll take it easy and step by step. I'm definitely hooked. It's a very addictive activity and I find myself always saying: Just one more shot, just one more . It's also wonderful because my husband and all 3 kids are involved too. What a great family sport. Going out on a hunt will be the icing on the cake one day.
Cheers,
Farmgirl (Andy)

[Bent Stick]

80% of improving is enjoying the journey farmgirl I'm sure your going to be pretty good at it and instinctive shooting accurately comes with practice the best ballistic fire control computer in the world is right between your ears.

Have fun with it and it will come together nicely

[wishsong]

.

- Each practice session should be about increasing the % of really good Shots.

regards Jacko

This should be a sticky on every archery forum , in every archers bow case , and carved into everyone's bedposts ...

[Ganthor]

Total archery newbe myself. I regularly struggle with this. (although I'm in the 80%'s of right handers and right eye dominant).

After a particularly disheartening session a few weeks ago, I tried to research why I hit left at 18m.

I found this:
http://www.angelfire.com/clone/archery/ ... group.html

I plan on printing it and keeping it with me so I can try to figure out what I'm doing when it is all going wrong.

The other thing I was told to try (consulting a coach on this) was use a strip of tape from top to bottom of the target face (butt?) instead of a target. The idea here to concentrate on hitting the tape (nothing else). The way I think it works is to restrict the problem solving in my form to left-right corrections.

I have no idea if any of this will work yet. - Just sharing what I'm trying.

[Dennis La Varenne]

Farmgirl,

There has been a lot of advice and suggestions about the cause of your 'left-shooting' problem, but you probably need to get down to 'first principles' first and establish just which eye is your dominant eye.

All of us, including we instinctive shooters still need to have the arrow aligned with out dominant eye, even though we are not aware of that alignment when the shot is taken, just as you have explained when you take a shot using your basketball analogy.

To establish your dominant eye, do the following -
1. Hold a small ring of any kind out in front of you at arm's length (either arm).
2. Have somebody stand directly in front of you and looking at you (your husband perhaps???).
3. Look through this ring at one of his eyes with both of your eyes open.
4. Get him to tell you which of your eyes is directly behind the ring - THAT IS YOUR DOMINANT EYE.

There are varying methods of ascertaining your dominant eye, but they all involve similar methods to the above.

Once you have established your dominant eye - if it is opposite to your normal shooting side - your BEST effort should be to learning to shoot on that same side as your dominant eye and build your muscles up accordingly. Alternatively, keep shooting on whatever side you are currently shooting and keep the dominant eye closed if that eye is opposite your normal shooting side so it doesn't have any affect on eye-arrow-target alignment. If it is open, your brain will always try to align the arrow with it because your dominant eye is what your brain naturally uses to line things up.

The non-dominant eye is what your brain uses in conjunction with the dominant eye to give depth perception so that you can estimate distance using the method of triangulation, ie, both eyes converge on a point forming a triangle between your two eyes as the base of the triangle and the line from your eyes to the target are the sides of the isosceles triangle. It is the angle of convergence between both eyes onto a distant object which allows your brain to estimate distance. When you 'aim', and line your dominant eye up with the arrow and target, that triangle changes shape to a right-angled triangle, but the way your brain works in estimating distance is the same.

Unless you sort this out, all your further training will be in vain because your poor brain will forever be trying to compensate. Brain's are remarkable things in what they can adapt to, but there is a limit and even if you develop perfect form, you will always be adapting to that inherent disadvantage.All the rest of the advice about spine of arrows etc., is secondary to working out which is your dominant eye RIGHT FROM THE START.

The inherent presumption behind all the other quite pertinent advice above is that you are shooting from your dominant eye, so you really need to establish that that is what you are doing first.

[Jim]

If you have an Iphone you can get a free coaching app called ubersense that has really easy to use and fine control slow motion replay functions. I stick my phone on something stable to watch me while I shoot. After each shot I say out loud where the arrow went (e.g. hit, high right, left, etc) so as I watch the replay later I can see what is happening for each hit and specific types of misses. It can be a pretty useful training aid.