Going Southpaw

[Brumbies Country]

I have suffered from TP on and off the last 4 years, but mostly on and as a result I've only every now and again shot a competitive round I've ben happy with. I've tried prettywell all, no, probably all, the recommended corrective regimes and could write a small book on the subject.

Legend has it that Fred Bear and Howard Hill at various times had it and switched sides- going from right to left handed or vv for the same reason. I'm not sure the mental reasoning behind that other than it breaks up an established routine and may combat the most common symptom, premature release.

I am left handed in double handed sports, cricket and golf and was originally southpaw in boxing, but as aginst that I play single handed sport right handed and have always shot a bow that way. I haven't tried the LH approach until now, principally because 3 of the 4 rotator cuff muscles in left arm have impaired nerve supply and there have been some small tears also in that area.

Last night I thought I'd give it a go and initially shot a 30lb RH longbow left handed off the knuckles. Hand didn't want to release first try but then it did. Interesting thing I've always neded a spacer in my tab for a RH Med release but I found I could release left handed bare fingered without any tab at all ( I don't have a LH tab). Another interesting thing was that the natural anchor point seemed to be best under the chin with the string lined up down the nose, something I never seemed to be able to do with a trad bow shooting right handed. Using that anchor I constantly shot 1-2 feet above the target at 5-15 m but the arrows were very straight. Dominant right eye didn't seem to be a problem. Then I tried a side of face anchor and needed to really crouch over, and cant the bow to avoid shooting markedly to the right. I then shot a 37lb self bow which, without a shelf, lends itself to shooting off either side. I've more strength shooting LH then I'd envisaged.

Some questions arise from this. I presume it's true Fred Bear and Howard Hill at some time went over to the other side for the same reason? Anybody else on this site attempted the same thing? On a US trad site there seemed to be a number of archers who have switched over for the same reason. Any additional tips anybody has got?

Simon

[longbowinfected]

I have a 43 pound blackwood longbow that I do not use that you can borrow plus tab but do not have any spare left handed arrows.

Try using a 3d hat with the attachment for covering the vision for your right eye, more comfortable than wearing a patch and easier than closing one eye for some. I have to admit that I keep both eyes ope whilst shooting LH. I can shoot right handed but ned to close my left eye or use a patch.

Welcome to our patch newbie. I really wish you well with this. I am in awe of your persistence and the effort you put in Simon to bend a stick. I am thankful that I have enjoyed a free run.

Kev

[longbowinfected]

Simon, going southpaw seems to have given you double vision and double trigger finger....you have double posted this thread.

Not that I have a perfect record in that regard but unashamedly I could not resist on commenting.

Kevin
Kevin

bloody contagious.

[Brumbies Country]

Thanks Kev

Sorry about the double vision bit-there's obviously a carry over. Re the lend of the bow that is very generous and I may take you up on that. I do have some self bows that lend themselves OK to this. I do have a stack of left handed arrows .

I must admit of thinking of you when I arrived at the under the chin anchor. As I recall you use that for all disciplines, target, field, and clout. I tried your method RH but never got on top of it. LH, it's a natural. Only thing is the field gaps are pretty large.

Great to hear from you.

Simon

[Brumbies Country]

I need to correct one thing from my first email. I did a bit of research at lunchtime. It appears that Howard Hill and Fred Bear did switch from right to left, or in Fred's case vv, on occasions but it is not apparent on that search why they did it. TP didn't crack a mention in the references I looked at.

However looking at a US trad site a while ago it became apparent that some had done it as a last resort, get this right or think about giving it away sort of situation.

[Stickbow Hunter]

Simon,

Fred Bear was left handed but I believe it was because of an injury or some such thing and not because of target panic. I have ever heard of Howard Hill shooting left handed.

As you know i am left handed and I am a snap shooter; when I shoot right handed I actually draw back and anchor. I find it hard to concentrate on a spot that way but that may be because of my left eye dominance and the fact I shoot both eyes open. I guess all that isn't much help for you though sorry.

Jeff

[hazard]

Simon
I am a very proud "Lefty" but also can shoot R/H even with over 55lb bows! I found this out when a friend near gave me 2 R/H bows (425 BUCKS EACH) and although it took me a few shots to warm up, I am nearly mirror reverse in style. If you are instinctive I would shoot with both eyes open as I find no change except you do hold your arm more to the other side. Though enicially I did find 3 fingers under worked better as I pinched the arrow too much R/Handed, but adjusted with more practice.

With continual practice I think you will be surprised at the result. When I first started Archery a friend in the club shot L/H because of his Left eye dominance, He was by far the best in our club.

Hazard

[TomMcDonald]

I'm right handed with everything I do except archery. It just feels better. Still suffer from TP from time to time though Maybe I should go RIGHT!

Good luck Simon. Let us know how it goes for you.

[slvrslngr]

I dabble with shooting lefty every now and then. I'm left eye dominant, but right handed and taught myself to shoot righty as I didn't know any better and it's my strong side. The first few times shooting left were awkward and a bit frightening to be honest. My first shot went over the target and hit the shed, oops! Anyway, I think everyone should shoot with both hands, it really makes you evaluate how you shoot a bow and has helped me shoot better on my strong side (right). Fortunately my wife shoots lefty so I use her bow which is 40#'s. If you do try switching sides, shoot as light a bow as you can find, it will make the process way easier. Don't rush your shots and if you start to get frustrated, stop shooting and come back to it another day. It's easy to instill bad habits if you rush and force the issue. Good luck with conquering your TP, it's frustrating but you can overcome it!

[Brumbies Country]

Simon,

Fred Bear was left handed but I believe it was because of an injury or some such thing and not because of target panic. I have ever heard of Howard Hill shooting left handed.

As you know i am left handed and I am a snap shooter; when I shoot right handed I actually draw back and anchor. I find it hard to concentrate on a spot that way but that may be because of my left eye dominance and the fact I shoot both eyes open. I guess all that isn't much help for you though sorry.

Jeff

Thanks Jeff

Fred Bear apparently injured a finger in a type of crusher machine when young and that influenced him to shoot left handed. I occasionally have a look at a US trad website and a couple of postings mentioned Fred and Howard Hill swapping over from time to time and it was inplied that it was TP but I can't find any reference to that being the reason.

Interesting your comment about anchoring when you shoot RH in contrast to your usual left handed style. Last night I again had some shots left handed then shot right handed and I found I could really hold better RH than I had. Something to do with interuption of normal thought processes maybe. Like any correction for TP it does need to stand-up to the pressures of competition or hunting depending what floats your boat most.

Simon

[Brumbies Country]

Simon
I am a very proud "Lefty" but also can shoot R/H even with over 55lb bows! I found this out when a friend near gave me 2 R/H bows (425 BUCKS EACH) and although it took me a few shots to warm up, I am nearly mirror reverse in style. If you are instinctive I would shoot with both eyes open as I find no change except you do hold your arm more to the other side. Though enicially I did find 3 fingers under worked better as I pinched the arrow too much R/Handed, but adjusted with more practice.

With continual practice I think you will be surprised at the result. When I first started Archery a friend in the club shot L/H because of his Left eye dominance, He was by far the best in our club.

Hazard

Thanks Hazard

I reckon that's really impressive being able to shoot a 55lb bow from your non-natural side. I too shoot with both eyes open and therefore found with a central anchor that I got no lateral arrow deviation. Left handed with split finger I found I didn't pinch the arrow, which came as a pleasant surprise.

Simon

[Brumbies Country]

Hi slvrsinr

i reckon you are right in dabbling with left every now and again. Some time ago I read of exercises that advocated repeatedly drawing your bow on the opposite side to which you normally shoot. I did it in a very small way but now think there are big advantages in equal muscle development, and it has a part in preventing musclulo-skeletal injury

[Brumbies Country]

I'm right handed with everything I do except archery. It just feels better. Still suffer from TP from time to time though Maybe I should go RIGHT!

Good luck Simon. Let us know how it goes for you.

Thanks Tom

I really appreciated your PMs yesterday. You know what TP is like. A large factor is the passion for what you do. Without that it's not likely be a problem. I play golf every now again for fun and never am never likely to get the yips while putting. I shoot bows for fun too, but there is that driving force to shoot better scores and the realisation that it shouldn't be hard. Having said that plenty of people have a pasion for shooting bows and never have the problem and that's great.

I've tried pretty well every recommended TP counter measure:
1) Blank bale-good basis for all TP treatment
2) Let-down and re-draw
3) Hold on other objects and figure of 8
4) Draw, close eyes close to full draw, open at full draw, hold and realign
5) Overdraw, then come back to normal anchor
6) Visualisation
7) Hypnosis
Clicker and similar such as arrow fletch touching the top lip
9) Lower expectations eg use of historic bow

I've read Jay Kidwell's book and recently saw the 4th Masters of the Barebow. All these measures help in the short term and I find I need to swap them around.

Life is all about challenge. One or two challenges you could do without .

Simon

[TomMcDonald]

I'm right handed with everything I do except archery. It just feels better. Still suffer from TP from time to time though Maybe I should go RIGHT!

Good luck Simon. Let us know how it goes for you.

Thanks Tom

I really appreciated your PMs yesterday. You know what TP is like. A large factor is the passion for what you do. Without that it's not likely be a problem. I play golf every now again for fun and never am never likely to get the yips while putting. I shoot bows for fun too, but there is that driving force to shoot better scores and the realisation that it shouldn't be hard. Having said that plenty of people have a pasion for shooting bows and never have the problem and that's great.

I've tried pretty well every recommended TP counter measure:
1) Blank bale-good basis for all TP treatment
2) Let-down and re-draw
3) Hold on other objects and figure of 8
4) Draw, close eyes close to full draw, open at full draw, hold and realign
5) Overdraw, then come back to normal anchor
6) Visualisation
7) Hypnosis
Clicker and similar such as arrow fletch touching the top lip
9) Lower expectations eg use of historic bow

I've read Jay Kidwell's book and recently saw the 4th Masters of the Barebow. All these measures help in the short term and I find I need to swap them around.

Life is all about challenge. One or two challenges you could do without .

Simon

Simon, it has to work, the law of probability demands it!

[wishsong]

I'm a righty who as a result of a Crowd Control incident lost much of the vision in my right eye ... hence my joining the ranks of such esteemed archers as
Bob Swinehart
Glenn St Charles
Jim Dougherty
Ron LeClair

Took me a month and haven't looked back .
I can still pull more poundage Righty than Lefty though !

Lefty's are just more handsome ... aren't we Jeff ?

[TomMcDonald]

We should make a lefty sub-forum that's password protected from the masses.

[wishsong]

I hear Ya Tom ...

Then we can talk about real stuff ... like left handed screw drivers .......

[Stickbow Hunter]

Lefty's are just more handsome ... aren't we Jeff ?

Well, that just might be pushing it a bit mate. You left Fred Bear off ya list.

Jeff

[longbowinfected]

Would make an interesting survey. A sub question might be to determine why some shoot one way or another. I know of a number of archers who shoot against their dominant eye and most of those are bare bowers. Some do it because of injuries etc. In my case I was left handed as a kid and made to swap to right handed. Diferent sports I use different hands or both. Shooting longarms I have used RH bolt action rifles using my left eye. did not realise I was shooting left handed until years later when a mate went to look through my scope.

Most of the longbowers at the Nationals and State titles in AA / ASNSW are lefties. In ordinary society I wonder what the percentage would be? I also wonder if thereare differences across bow types? At another place there was beginning to be compelling trend for some personality types being more prevalent in archery.

I bet Grahame A would have some interesting thoughts there.

Kev

[wishsong]

Well, that just might be pushing it a bit mate. You left Fred Bear off ya list.

Jeff

Oooppss !

[Gilly]

I am right handed but shoot lefthanded bows, it feels alien picking up a right handed bow, it always has!
I am left eye dominant and even though I keep both eyes open, it just feels "right" shooting left handed.

[hazard]

Well you wont find me arguing with that!

[Benny Nganabbarru]

There's a photo on THE MOTHER OF ALL HILL LONGBOW THREADS at TradGang now showing Howard shooting left-handed. But I do not know if they got the film back-to-front or not.

[longbowinfected]

Oh, someone took a photo of me and reversed it too then.

Kev

[AndyF]

Thought I'd join in.

I'm right handed but shoot left. Was told when I first started I would have to shoot left handed as I'm left eye dominant. Never really thought about it since. That said, I get TP. So maybe I'll have a crack at right-handed. Anyone got a right-handed 55lb Diamond SS Tomahawk and a right-handed Fox Triple Crown I can borrow?

Andy

[Brumbies Country]

I haven't been to the site for a while but good to have just had a catchup. I have shot little of late due to training and riding a horse for endurance competition. Completed a couple of 80km rides, so thick in the hide, but weak in the shooting muscles .

Good to see that others have found that the great Howard Hill did indeed shoot left handed.

Re target panic I'd had a bad run with it last two or three years. Recently I was up in Queensland and shot my sons Grozer assymetric Hunnish horse bow. I've been really keen on traditional/historic bows for a long time but never engaged with the horsebows, indeed until then had never shot one. Well I very rapidly fell in love with this one and was impressed with the way it shot for me. A bottom line was that I had no trace of target panic. This was not truly a competition though let it be fairly said that the three of us were doing our darndest to outshoot each other in a pointscoring system. I'd have to run the gamut of an official competition, but I think the lesson might be once the passion for archery is diluted by another keen interest, then some propensity for target panic is removed. This was not a controlled study, and n=1, but it makes some sort of sense to me.

Simon

[Gilly]

Pardon my ignorance but what is target panic??

[alaninoz]

I'd have to run the gamut of an official competition, but I think the lesson might be once the passion for archery is diluted by another keen interest, then some propensity for target panic is removed. This was not a controlled study, and n=1, but it makes some sort of sense to me.

Simon

Welcome back Simon. I think it's not so much that the passion for archery has been diluted, as that the self-generated performance anxiety has gone as your self image is no longer wrapped up in archery.

I wonder what the horse riding equivalent of target panic is.

[Stickbow Hunter]

Pardon my ignorance but what is target panic??

It's a physiological phenomenon that effects your ability to aim, draw and release as you normally would. Mostly it causes you to release when you didn't wish to; especially when under some pressure like in a target competition or when drawing on an animal while Bowhunting. It is extremely frustrating and is very hard to get over.

Jeff

[Gilly]

Thanks for explaining Jeff, I had not heard of it before! I don't think I suffer from it luckily!