Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

How to make a Bow, a String or a Set of Arrows. Making equipment & tools for use in Traditional Archery and Bowhunting.

Moderator: Moderators

Message
Author
User avatar
Flatliner
Posts: 449
Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:12 pm
Location: Gordonvale NTH QLD

Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#1 Post by Flatliner » Sat Apr 13, 2013 12:31 am

Here we go again. :roll: In this build-along I'll try to get down to some of the more basic stuff so it is a little easier for the first timers to understand. I'll also be using some of the text and photos from my other build where the steps are identical.

The Raptor is a rather complicated and difficult bow to build but it has a very smooth draw all the way out to 30 inches is dead in the hand, very fast and very forgiving. With performance values like that in a 58 inch bow its well worth the extra effort.

Having said that the basic construction methods set out here can be applied to any composite laminated bow design keeping in mind that this is how I build bows. I’m sure there are many totally viable variations to the methods I use.

Now for a bit of a dodgy start I forgot to take any photos of the riser block prep so I will describe it as best I can.
All Flatline risers are made from 4 separate pieces of timber glued together with thin, usually contrasting veneers between. This is done to guard against the inherent instability and movement you get in all timbers due to temperature and humidity. I use “Techniglue CA” an Australian made epoxy with very good flexibility and tensile and bond strength stats for all of my bow work.

I start by milling the selected timber (in this case Purple Gidgee and Silver Ash) into pieces the appropriate size and 1 or 2 mm thicker than I want them to finish at. They are then ground to the required thickness using a 36 grit belt on the lam grinder and glued into a 45 mm wide block. The Raptor riser is made from a block like this and another crescent shaped piece (in this case Hairy Oak)which forms the back of the riser because the glass on the back of the bow goes through the riser as opposed to over the back of the bow. These 2 pieces are marked out using stencils, cut on the band saw and have to be ground to match perfectly and the crescent piece must match the bow form (mould).
SDC12396.JPG
SDC12396.JPG (152.17 KiB) Viewed 12719 times
This is the form I will be using. It has some pretty extreme curves which make the lay-up quite challenging.
SDC12398.JPG
SDC12398.JPG (97.79 KiB) Viewed 12719 times
Here’s where the Raptor is a little different from most one piece bows, usually in a one piece the riser incorporates the fades (the thin wedged part that leads into the limbs) in the one piece of timber. But in the case of the Raptor I’ve made the wedges separately and glued them into the riser block. I’ve done this for several reasons, being; the unusual shape of the riser, I can get a much finer, longer, accurate taper leading into the limb and I can use my timber of choice Silver Ash for wedges.
Here’s how it’s done, the main block is marked out using the same template, then clamped into a 17 degree jig and using a 10 degree dove tail bit in the router the limb planes are formed as I would do if I was making a take-down.
SDC12402.JPG
SDC12402.JPG (188.8 KiB) Viewed 12719 times
SDC12403.JPG
SDC12403.JPG (170.63 KiB) Viewed 12719 times
These surfaces are roughened up to insure that when the wedges are glued they have a good bond.
SDC12404.JPG
SDC12404.JPG (156.47 KiB) Viewed 12719 times
The block is then marked and pieces cut out to allow for clamping and gluing of the wedges.
SDC12407.JPG
SDC12407.JPG (105.77 KiB) Viewed 12719 times
Wedge blanks are cut on the band saw using a wedge template against the fence.
SDC11152.JPG
SDC11152.JPG (165.69 KiB) Viewed 12719 times
Then ground on the lam grinder using the same template. The wedges are 8 1/4" long and 300 thou thick at the butt end which makes them very finely tapered. The butt end of the wedges are cut at 10 degrees to match the angle left by the router, this helps to key them into the riser block.
SDC11154.JPG
SDC11154.JPG (165.11 KiB) Viewed 12719 times
Your wedges (or fades) need to have a consistant taper that ends in a finely feathered edge.
When you hold the wedge up to the light it should look like this.
SDC11156.JPG
SDC11156.JPG (132.41 KiB) Viewed 12719 times
Here they are ready to be assembled and glued. I leave the wedges a little wider than the riser block to allow them to be dressed down to size once they are fixed in place.
SDC12408.JPG
SDC12408.JPG (83.61 KiB) Viewed 12719 times
I've run out of atachment space, to be continued in the next post.

Rob.
The shortest distance between two points is a FLATLINE
ImageEmail; robnicoll(at)bigpond(dot)com
www.flatlinebows.com.au

User avatar
Flatliner
Posts: 449
Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:12 pm
Location: Gordonvale NTH QLD

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#2 Post by Flatliner » Sat Apr 13, 2013 12:58 am

And in the clamps.
SDC12411.JPG
SDC12411.JPG (116.49 KiB) Viewed 12717 times
After cleaning them up a bit the riser block is marked to fade into the wedges and the pieces carefully removed on the band saw.
SDC12418.JPG
SDC12418.JPG (69.11 KiB) Viewed 12717 times
Then very carefully ground to merge into the wedges, these curves must be constant with no lumps or bumps because the belly limb laminations and glass have to bend smoothly around them.

The riser block along with the crescent piece is then matched to the form, it is essential that this is a very neat fit so there are no areas of variation in pressure when in the form.
SDC12421.JPG
SDC12421.JPG (102.96 KiB) Viewed 12717 times
The riser block is now finished and is put aside in a safe place ready for the lay-up.

Now we move onto the limb laminations, which are milled from carefully selected boards for straightness of grain and appearance, they are cut a little oversized to allow for grinding. In the raptors case the glass is 39 mm/1 ½” wide even though the riser is 45 mm/1 ¾” wide for strength, so the timber lams are milled at around 2.5 mm/1/8” thick by 40 mm wide to allow for a final sizing to match the glass. Then using a new 40 grit belt (it’s important to use a new sharp belt no smoother than 40 grit for this to insure you get a good glue bond in this all important part of the build) I grind them flat and parallel until all the saw marks are gone.

Using a set of calipers to measure, the lams are ground to the required thickness, in this case the goal being 52# @ 28’ a total core thickness of 133 thousandths of an inch with all three lams stacked together is required. I measure this thickness in 3 or 4 places along the length of the stacked lams and take an average. (There is always a little variation.) With this design every thou in thickness means 1 pound in draw weight.

The same lam format as my MC take-down limbs is used in the Raptor. That being; they are are made up of three lams in total, The back lam is a 0.001"/1" (one thousandth of an inch in thickness per one inch in length) tapered lam, usually 25 thou at the butt/riser end and approximately 50 thou at the tip on all MC limbs unless very high draw weights are required. The belly lam is a 25 thou parallel veneer and a tapered Bamboo core which tapers at the same rate in the opposite direction to the back lam, so the total core is in reality parallel. The bamboo lam thickness is adjusted to change the overall core thickness.

This format brings one of the glue lines in the limb from nearly center at the knock tip, too 25 thou off the back glass at the butt of the limb. IMO this gives better tension strength over the wedge area (which is a hard working part of the limb in every bow) and balances the thicker material that is in compression on the belly at this point also.

The back lam is the full length of the bow and runs through the riser along with the glass. Due to the length of the material available and aesthetics I have made this lam from 2 pieces of timber joined in the middle by tapering and gluing them together like this.
SDC12423.JPG
SDC12423.JPG (70.89 KiB) Viewed 12717 times
This is done while still in the rough, oversized state then ground to precise thickness using a master taper.

Here's a pic showing the tapered Bamboo lam being ground with a 0.001"/1" graduated Hard rock Maple Master taper, each mark on the taper is two inches so in theory, by moving your lam toward the thick end of the master taper, each mark will reduce the lam by 2 thou.

Note: It is extremely important when grinding your lams to push/draw them through the grinder at a constant speed/pressure. If you vary the speed or worse than that, stop, the result will be dips and variations in thickness which in the finished bow become week areas or points of failure in the limb.
SDC12425.JPG
SDC12425.JPG (164.24 KiB) Viewed 12717 times
The glass is pre-ground on one side and smooth on the other from the supplier in accurate thicknesses of different sizes, I will be using 40 thou on the back and 50 thou on the belly. Any surface on the glass you don’t want glue on must be covered with low-tack masking tape prior to the lay-up. Part of the smooth side of the back glass on this bow has to be sanded to take the front, crescent shaped piece that makes up that part of the riser.

Here’s a photo of all the components of the bow ready to be assembled. The timbers used for the lams are Brown Tulip Oak (the long piece) and Red Tulip Oak.
SDC12430.JPG
SDC12430.JPG (57.39 KiB) Viewed 12717 times
It is always wise to assemble the bow completely and DRY in the form before you do any gluing, this allows you to sort out most of the difficulties (apart from glue related ones) you will encounter in the actual lay-up, give you some idea how long it will take and if you need to call in reinforcements for the event.

It’s important to avoid handling the surfaces to be glued and keep your hands clean at all times, the oils produced on your skin will reduce the bond achieved and can result in bond failure.

Here’s the dry run. First the male part of the form which is clamped to the bench has a layer of cling wrap taped over it as a bond breaker for glue drips and such, and prevents the bow from being glued to the form.

Then the pieces are assembled in this order; the crescent, the back glass (masked side down against the form), the tapered back lam (thick at the tips, thin at the riser), the riser, the Bamboo core (thick end towards the riser), the belly lams and then the glass. All these components are bent into place and held there with that heavy duty cling wrap they use for bundling timber and such at the hardware. Because of the extreme curves in this particular form I have a purpose built clamping arrangement that holds the riser assembly in place and completes the curve that the hose has to take in the mould.

In the photo below you can see a black strip lying on the red hose in the female part of the form in the back ground, this is the pressure strip, made from 1.5mm sheet metal and coated on one side with 1 mm thick neoprene. It is placed between the bow components and the fire hose to help spread the pressure evenly across the surface of the limbs.
SDC12454.JPG
SDC12454.JPG (131.79 KiB) Viewed 12717 times
With the pressure strip in place.
SDC12452.JPG
SDC12452.JPG (113.2 KiB) Viewed 12717 times
The entire male section of the form is then wrapped in cling wrap so no glue gets on the hose. The female part of the form along with the hose is then placed over the male part or visa versa and bolted in place. The hose is inflated to about 65 PSI and the whole assembly checked to make sure the glue lines will be good and everything is where it should be.

If you have tight curves in you design it pays to make sure that the hose is not being stretched through them, in fact it doesn’t hurt to gather the hose a little in these areas to make sure enough pressure is applied when pumped up.

The dry run, In the form with everything in place.
SDC12450.JPG
SDC12450.JPG (104.11 KiB) Viewed 12717 times
The lay-up: When I lay-up a raptor I enlist the help of whoever is available, and turn on the air conditioner bring the temp in the shed down below 20 degrees (to extend the glue’s working time to about 30 minutes). You have to have everything ready before you start and work fast because if it’s not in the form with full pressure in the hose within that time it simply won’t work.

The timber and bamboo lams are placed in the heat box for about 10 minutes to remove excess moisture that will be replaced by glue to achieve a better bond. Then the assembly process set out above is repeated but this time an even coating of well mixed “Techniglue” is applied to all surfaces to be glued as it is put together.

The hose is then inflated to 20 PSI while I clean up the left over glue, then the pressure is raised to 40 PSI for a couple of minutes and then finally to 65 PSI, this is done because in theory at low pressure there is more pressure applied to the center of the limbs and thus the glue and any air bubbles it contains are pushed to the edge and out of the limb.

The form is then placed into the heat box for at least 8 hours at 55-60 degrees Celsius.
SDC12457.JPG
SDC12457.JPG (85.81 KiB) Viewed 12717 times
Stay tuned
Last edited by Flatliner on Mon Apr 22, 2013 5:16 pm, edited 2 times in total.
The shortest distance between two points is a FLATLINE
ImageEmail; robnicoll(at)bigpond(dot)com
www.flatlinebows.com.au

User avatar
Flatliner
Posts: 449
Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:12 pm
Location: Gordonvale NTH QLD

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#3 Post by Flatliner » Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:03 am

The heat box is not strictly necessary particularly if you live in a warm/hot climate but a better bond is achieved and the process is a lot faster if one is used. There are options such as placing your form in a closed car in the sun or the ceiling cavity of your house or shed on a hot day.

When the times up take the form out of the heat box and let it cool completely before letting the pressure out of the hose. Disassemble the form and remove your bow blank.

Cooling after the heat box.
SDC12458.JPG
SDC12458.JPG (107.14 KiB) Viewed 12717 times
The finished bow blank, glue dags and all.
SDC12460.JPG
SDC12460.JPG (119.25 KiB) Viewed 12717 times
To be continued.

Cheers, Rob.
The shortest distance between two points is a FLATLINE
ImageEmail; robnicoll(at)bigpond(dot)com
www.flatlinebows.com.au

User avatar
yeoman
Posts: 1563
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2004 1:32 pm
Location: Canberra

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#4 Post by yeoman » Sat Apr 13, 2013 7:08 am

This looks fantastic mate. The glued in fades are a stroke of genius.

It took me a while to realise what I was looking at in the photo of the female part of the form with the hose and neoprene strip. At first I thought it was part of a form for a horsebow, back side facing up.

Looking forward to seeing more of this.

Are you a joiner/cabinetmaker by trade?
https://www.instagram.com/armworks_australia/

Bow making courses, knife making courses, armour making courses and more:
http://www.tharwavalleyforge.com/

Articles to start making bows:
http://www.tharwavalleyforge.com/index. ... /tutorials

User avatar
GrahameA
Posts: 4692
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2005 4:28 pm
Location: Welcome to Brisneyland, Oz

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#5 Post by GrahameA » Sat Apr 13, 2013 7:22 am

Morning.


A great buildalong. Really gives readers a feel for whats goes into building a bow.
Grahame.
Shoot a Selfbow, embrace Wood Arrows, discover Vintage, be a Trendsetter.

"Unfortunately, the equating of simplicity with truth doesn't often work in real life. It doesn't often work in science, either." Dr Len Fisher.

User avatar
bigbob
Posts: 4098
Joined: Sat Jul 10, 2010 8:55 pm
Location: sunshine coast

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#6 Post by bigbob » Sat Apr 13, 2013 9:00 am

Another great buildalong Rob! Very informative and really shows the amount of work involved in building one of your custom bows .
nil illigitimo in desperandum carborundum
razorbows.com

User avatar
Macca
Posts: 152
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2011 7:57 pm
Location: Southern Highlands NSW

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#7 Post by Macca » Sat Apr 13, 2013 11:50 am

Very nice Rob, it's good to see the workmanship that goes into these bows. Is this bow for Dave?

Cheers Macca.

User avatar
scuzz
Posts: 126
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2012 12:38 pm
Location: Newcastle, NSW

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#8 Post by scuzz » Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:53 pm

I havnt seen many 'One piece - Recurve Buildalongs', thanks for this rob, its great.

Scuzz

User avatar
Flatliner
Posts: 449
Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:12 pm
Location: Gordonvale NTH QLD

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#9 Post by Flatliner » Sat Apr 13, 2013 4:28 pm

Thanks blokes.
Macca wrote: Is this bow for Dave?
It sure is maca.

It's finished actually, out in the shed waiting for the last coat to dry properlly. Can't wait to put it through the crono, I've only put 1/2 a dozen arrows through it and it seamed pretty darned fast.
yeoman wrote:Are you a joiner/cabinetmaker by trade?
I'm actually a carpenter/builder by trade, but I've allways liked the finer work.

Cheers, Rob.
The shortest distance between two points is a FLATLINE
ImageEmail; robnicoll(at)bigpond(dot)com
www.flatlinebows.com.au

longbow steve
Posts: 3116
Joined: Tue Jan 30, 2007 3:29 pm
Location: BLUE MOUNTAINS

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#10 Post by longbow steve » Sat Apr 13, 2013 4:44 pm

Hi Rob, thanks for taking the time to do the build along. Looking forward to the next installment. Cheers Steve

User avatar
Stickbow Hunter
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 11637
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2003 8:33 pm
Location: Maryborough Queensland

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#11 Post by Stickbow Hunter » Sat Apr 13, 2013 5:06 pm

A good build-a-long once again Rob.

Jeff

User avatar
woodie
Posts: 686
Joined: Sun May 06, 2007 9:10 pm
Location: hunter valley, NSW

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#12 Post by woodie » Sat Apr 13, 2013 6:28 pm

Thanks for this I will have to read it a few time as I keep getting interrupted with the kids, teenagers got to love them.
woodie
may your arrows fly straight and true and your limbs return.

User avatar
Macca
Posts: 152
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2011 7:57 pm
Location: Southern Highlands NSW

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#13 Post by Macca » Sun Apr 14, 2013 7:45 am

Flatliner wrote:Thanks blokes.
Macca wrote: Is this bow for Dave?
It sure is maca.

Very nice mate, Dave will be happy with that. :biggrin: It will be interesting to see what speeds she pushes out. What poundage did she finish up at?

Cheers Macca.

User avatar
Flatliner
Posts: 449
Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:12 pm
Location: Gordonvale NTH QLD

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#14 Post by Flatliner » Sun Apr 14, 2013 1:55 pm

And onward ever onward.


The bulk of the excess glue is taken off on the flat face of my lam grinder and carefully sanded back to the edge of the glass on the sanding deck (a piece of floor sander belt clamped to the bench) which helps maintain a nice straight face on the edge of the limb.
SDC12464.JPG
SDC12464.JPG (77.62 KiB) Viewed 12606 times
Here it is cleaned up.
SDC12461.JPG
SDC12461.JPG (129.69 KiB) Viewed 12606 times

The bow blank is then placed back on the form and the position of the knock tips and cut off points are marked. The marks are squared across the limb on both sides because you lose the marks on the edge when the limbs are cut to shape. I allow 25 mm for knock tips to make sure there are no dramas with stringer pockets being too deep.

While it’s sitting firmly and correctly in the form I also mark center of the limb at the tips by measuring off the form because I know my form is straight but there could be some variation to straight in the bow blank.
SDC12463.JPG
SDC12463.JPG (172.15 KiB) Viewed 12606 times
The ends of the limbs are cut off at the appropriate point on the miter saw.

Then using the center of limb marks and a flexible limb profile template taped to the butt of the limb, mark your limb shape.
SDC11202.JPG
SDC11202.JPG (53.97 KiB) Viewed 12606 times
Notice how the template overhangs the limb a bit (which in effect wakes it a bit wider than the top limb which was marked with the template flush),,, that’s because this is the bottom limb and I want it to be slightly heavier for tilering purposes. I should also mention that the Bamboo core in the top limb is 1 thou thinner than the one in the bottom limb to the same purpose.

Now to cut it I use a jig saw with one of these in it.
SDC11204.JPG
SDC11204.JPG (55.1 KiB) Viewed 12606 times
They are designed for cutting thin stainless steel plate, I paid around $60 for three of them at Bunning’s, but they're well worth it. The blade I used today has already cut about 16 sets of limbs and is still going strong.
With the limb clamped firmly to a saw stool between rubber pads and griped close to the work area with one hand run the jig saw beside the line on the waste side. If you don't know your tool well, then cut a mm away from the line. Better safe than sorry.
SDC11206.JPG
SDC11206.JPG (68.64 KiB) Viewed 12606 times
OK then its back on to the sanding deck with 80 grit paper to dress out the jig saw marks. Remove only enough material to take out the machine marks and balance both sides of the limb to the profile marks. Keep an eye on the center marks at the tips too, it's easy to get the tips a little out of whack if you don't.
Then using a square mark the knock grooves at 45 degrees across the edge of the limb on both sides.
SDC11207.JPG
SDC11207.JPG (136.73 KiB) Viewed 12606 times
With the limb clamped to the bench with rubber pads (just assume from now on any clamping of the limbs will be padded) and using a bastard file carefully file material away until they are about 3mm deep at the knock groove line.
SDC11209.JPG
SDC11209.JPG (146.82 KiB) Viewed 12606 times
Then with a small chainsaw file round them off, carefully remove any sharp edges and burrs on the glass as these will cut your string in no time, (just ask me, I know )
SDC11211.JPG
SDC11211.JPG (151.89 KiB) Viewed 12606 times
Make sure your knock grooves are symmetrical and that they are the same height on both sides of the limb, otherwise this can cause confusing limb twist issues. I've also rounded the tips so they don't rip my stringer to bits.
SDC11213.JPG
SDC11213.JPG (159.01 KiB) Viewed 12606 times
Now I wrap the first foot from the tip of the limb in cling wrap to protect it from wax off the string and pad the knock tips a little. The bow is then strung using an end to end stringer and with the back of the riser on the ground and one foot on the riser to hold it down I draw the bow to full draw and let it down several times, maybe 10-15 times, this is to release tensions in the limbs and settle them in. It’s also when you check for any limb twist. Limb twist is when the string does not come to rest in the exact center of the limb at brace (the string on and the bow at rest) and can be remedied in cases of minimal twist by simply grabbing the limb at either end and twisting back the other way. But in cases where the twist is quite severe, the knock groove on the side of the limb it is twisting towards must be filed deeper and a similar amount of material removed from the same edge of the limb over the last several inches. This should be done in very small increments stringing the bow and checking for twist every time you make a small adjustment.
I then work out how I went with the draw weight and as it turns out the first weigh in is 56 # @ 28”, which is pretty good because you usually lose a pound or so in tilering and another in the rounding of the edges and 1 or 2 pound always seem to drift off into the air during the process of finishing the bow.
At this point the tiller is measured.
The tiller is a measurement of the strength of the limbs in relation to each other. Most bows require a positive tiller, which is the top limb should be slightly weaker than the bottom limb to account for the arrow rest being above center of the bow and having either two or three fingers under the arrow when drawing and releasing.
On the Raptor I measure out from the center of the bow 250 mm down each limb and put a pencil mark on one of the glue lines. With the bow strung I measure from this mark to the string at a point perpendicular to the string on both limbs and compare the measurements. The Raptor works best with about 3 mm of positive tiller,( that is the measurement on the top limb is 3 mm/1/8” bigger than that of the bottom limb) which is quite minimal, due I think, to the arrow shelf only being 19 mm/3/4” above center.
The tiller can be adjusted a little by removing material in equal amounts from both sides over the full length of the limb but there are limits to this method, if you remove too much you run the very real risk of destabilizing the limb completely and rendering the bow unusable. I have found that several pounds of draw weight can be removed by rounding the edge of the glass quite severely being careful not to thin it to the point of weakening the edge of the limb and making sure it is done symmetrically to avoid creating limb twist. In extreme circumstances you can remove material by careful and even sanding of the face of the glass (on the belly side only) but this is not recommended and should only be attempted as a last resort.
OK, it’s time to start shaping the riser, the profile is marked using the same riser template and cut out on the band saw. I cut through the glass with a hack saw because you only have to touch it with the band saw blade and you’re up for a new one.

Gota start a new post.
The shortest distance between two points is a FLATLINE
ImageEmail; robnicoll(at)bigpond(dot)com
www.flatlinebows.com.au

User avatar
Flatliner
Posts: 449
Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:12 pm
Location: Gordonvale NTH QLD

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#15 Post by Flatliner » Sun Apr 14, 2013 2:17 pm

SDC12474.JPG
SDC12474.JPG (131.23 KiB) Viewed 12605 times
SDC12476.JPG
SDC12476.JPG (85.85 KiB) Viewed 12605 times
The sight window is marked out and the material removed using a series of cuts with the hack saw (because of the glass in the riser) and a very sharp chisel.
SDC12480.JPG
SDC12480.JPG (173.41 KiB) Viewed 12605 times
SDC12484.JPG
SDC12484.JPG (190.58 KiB) Viewed 12605 times
Tidied up on the lam grinder and the cleaned up with a bastard file.
SDC12492.JPG
SDC12492.JPG (103.04 KiB) Viewed 12605 times
Shaping the riser, something I can't really guide you through, it's something that has to be learned by doing it, and because everyone’s hands are different and everyone’s idea of what shapes and curves look good, it's a very individual thing. But the best advice I can give you is; take your time and take less off than you think (it's easy to take it off but very hard to put back on. They haven't invented the wood welder yet ).
I always start by doing the critical parts first and working away from them, like the site window and then the throat or the neck (or whatever you call it :? ),,the narrowest part of the hand grip.
Always (when working on a machine) leave yourself a little more than you think to remove by hand, but by the same token don't leave yourself with a too bulky grip in fear of taking too much off, and when sanding by hand try to keep the paper moving in multiple directions.
I use a 16 grit belt to take the bulk off and then go down to a 24 to shape it and clean it up with a 40 grit belt before I start the hand sanding.
SDC12493.JPG
SDC12493.JPG (60.77 KiB) Viewed 12605 times
SDC12494.JPG
SDC12494.JPG (67.49 KiB) Viewed 12605 times
SDC12495.JPG
SDC12495.JPG (68.31 KiB) Viewed 12605 times
SDC12496.JPG
SDC12496.JPG (94.38 KiB) Viewed 12605 times
I use a 1" barrel sander in the drill press to clean up the throat of the grip. (the next few photos are from another build, forgot to take any of this one)
SDC11324.JPG
SDC11324.JPG (83.41 KiB) Viewed 12605 times
Next post.
Last edited by Flatliner on Sun Apr 14, 2013 2:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The shortest distance between two points is a FLATLINE
ImageEmail; robnicoll(at)bigpond(dot)com
www.flatlinebows.com.au

User avatar
Flatliner
Posts: 449
Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:12 pm
Location: Gordonvale NTH QLD

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#16 Post by Flatliner » Sun Apr 14, 2013 2:23 pm

Then it's a series of different grade strips of cloth backed paper, used in an omnidirectional manner.
SDC11327.JPG
SDC11327.JPG (139.13 KiB) Viewed 12603 times
After all the rough work is done the shelf is given a radius and beveled on the grinder.
SDC11336.JPG
SDC11336.JPG (120.94 KiB) Viewed 12603 times
SDC11355.JPG
SDC11355.JPG (135.67 KiB) Viewed 12603 times
SDC11360.JPG
SDC11360.JPG (177.74 KiB) Viewed 12603 times
And cleaned up with a file and 180 paper.
SDC11363.JPG
SDC11363.JPG (149.43 KiB) Viewed 12603 times
The Knock tips are built up with layered veneers of timber on a base of phenolic or glass glued into a block about 6 mm/1/4” thick which will make the tips strong enough to handle the stresses created when high performance string materials such as “Fast Flight” are used. Here I’ve used black phenolic, Silver Ash, Conkerberry and Hairy Oak. Using the limb tip as a template the knock tips are marked out of the block, cut on the band saw and roughly shaped, with the leading edge feathered into the limb.
SDC12478.JPG
SDC12478.JPG (87.9 KiB) Viewed 12445 times
After sanding the glass with very coarse paper the tips are glued and clamped in place.
Don’t remove all of the glue from the edge that feathers into the limb, leave a little and carefully cove it with your finger, this will make it easier to get a seamless finish.
SDC12482.JPG
SDC12482.JPG (152.61 KiB) Viewed 12445 times
SDC12490.JPG
SDC12490.JPG (93.77 KiB) Viewed 12445 times
The tips are then shaped with files and strips of cloth-backed sandpaper until a secure, friction free knock tip is formed.
SDC12487.JPG
SDC12487.JPG (91.5 KiB) Viewed 12445 times
SDC12489.JPG
SDC12489.JPG (70.62 KiB) Viewed 12445 times

To be continued,

Cheers, Rob.
Last edited by Flatliner on Mon Apr 22, 2013 5:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The shortest distance between two points is a FLATLINE
ImageEmail; robnicoll(at)bigpond(dot)com
www.flatlinebows.com.au

User avatar
Nephew
Posts: 3046
Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2007 1:28 pm
Location: Coochiemudlo Island,Moreton Bay, Qld.

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#17 Post by Nephew » Sun Apr 14, 2013 3:01 pm

Thanks for posting this, Rob. The patterns in your risers are always very eye catching, and this one is intriguing. Kinda vaguely "indigenous" (for want of a better word) somehow.
Lately, if life were treating me any better, I'd be suspicious of it's motives!

User avatar
greybeard
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 2992
Joined: Tue Feb 07, 2006 9:11 am
Location: Logan City QLD

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#18 Post by greybeard » Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:22 pm

Hi Rob,

Thank you for the build a long. It is indeed educational to look at the different techniques bowyers use to reach a similar outcome.

Daryl.
"And you must not stick for a groat or twelvepence more than another man would give, if it be a good bow.
For a good bow twice paid for, is better than an ill bow once broken.
[Ascham]

“If a cluttered desk is a sign of a cluttered mind, of what, then, is an empty desk a sign?” [Einstein]

I am old enough to make my own decisions....Just not young enough to remember what I decided!....

User avatar
rodlonq
Posts: 2096
Joined: Wed May 06, 2009 3:02 pm
Location: Ingham NQ

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#19 Post by rodlonq » Wed Apr 17, 2013 1:09 pm

Great buildalong Rob, cant wait to see pics of the finished product. Thanks for posting your work.

Cheers....... Rod

trash one
Posts: 259
Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2003 8:49 pm
Location: mount isa

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#20 Post by trash one » Wed Apr 17, 2013 8:02 pm

Hay Rob
The raptor is the smoothest bow I've shot it's amazing how such a short bow can draw so long without stacking.
Catch Ya
Butch

User avatar
Flatliner
Posts: 449
Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:12 pm
Location: Gordonvale NTH QLD

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#21 Post by Flatliner » Thu Apr 18, 2013 9:02 am

Hey Butchy, thanks for the plug. How's that quiver going, Grassy said it came up quite well.

Cheers, Rob.
The shortest distance between two points is a FLATLINE
ImageEmail; robnicoll(at)bigpond(dot)com
www.flatlinebows.com.au

trash one
Posts: 259
Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2003 8:49 pm
Location: mount isa

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#22 Post by trash one » Thu Apr 18, 2013 8:40 pm

Hay Rob
The quiver came out really good very light & quite. Hope to get out & do a bit more hunting over the next couple of weeks so this will a good test for it.
CATCH YA
BUTCH.

Mayhem
Posts: 1
Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:03 pm

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#23 Post by Mayhem » Sun Apr 21, 2013 6:42 pm

This is all very interesting, thank you for going to the effort of sharing the pics. Very beautiful work :)

User avatar
Flatliner
Posts: 449
Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:12 pm
Location: Gordonvale NTH QLD

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#24 Post by Flatliner » Mon Apr 22, 2013 6:18 pm

Continued from the edit of the last post.

Then it’s on to the string groove overlays. I start with thin veneers about 2 mm thick, 135 mm long and wide enough to suit the limb width at the overlay’s widest point. These are tapered from half their length too nothing being careful to keep a nice square edge where they feather out into the limb. I then bend them around the limb tip and mark the profile using the limb tip as a template and trim them into shape with a ruler and Stanley knife. The area on the limb where they are to go is rough sanded by hand with very coarse sandpaper.
SDC12479.JPG
SDC12479.JPG (123.42 KiB) Viewed 12445 times
After masking the edge of the limb to avoid getting glue where I don’t want it I use a stacked pyramid of rubber/neoprene strips (this insures even pressure across the width of the overlay) and duct tape to glue them on.
SDC11296.JPG
SDC11296.JPG (173.95 KiB) Viewed 12445 times
SDC11298.JPG
SDC11298.JPG (170.6 KiB) Viewed 12445 times

When the glue is dry the edges of the overlays are filed to match the edge of the limb and a center line is marked and carefully removed with a hack saw making sure not to cut into the glass.
SDC12497.JPG
SDC12497.JPG (83.24 KiB) Viewed 12445 times
SDC12499.JPG
SDC12499.JPG (82.56 KiB) Viewed 12445 times
This groove is V’ed with a small square file then rounded with a series of round files until the groove is the appropriate size to fit the string and smoothed out with sandpaper.

(More old photos)
SDC11383.JPG
SDC11383.JPG (84.88 KiB) Viewed 12445 times
SDC11388.JPG
SDC11388.JPG (93.16 KiB) Viewed 12445 times
SDC11389.JPG
SDC11389.JPG (82.68 KiB) Viewed 12445 times
It is extremely important that the grooves run dead center of the limb to avoid building a twist into it.


When the bow is sanded ready to put the first coat on I do a draw force curve and establish the final draw weight. As you can see below, “PEDRO” (as Dave has chosen to name this bow in honor of his friend the late Pedro Lever) has come out pretty much on the mark at 52 # @ 28”.
Image.jpg
Image.jpg (74.54 KiB) Viewed 12445 times

I'll have a bit of a rave about how I go about coating my bows but I'm not a spray painter so it's just what I do.
First I sand all the timber surfaces with 240 grit paper until ALL of the machine marks are gone, then a coat of pressure pack satin. This is allowed to dry for two days and then sanded off, and I mean off, it's only used as grain filler and should only remain in the pores not on the surface of the timber. Then the masking tape is removed from the glass which is sanded with the grain using 240 grit wet and dry That’s the last time I use sand paper, unless I get a run or something,,, native bees, dog hair, sideways rain, green frogs, elephant beetles etc in the coat. From here on I just use 000 grade steel wool to remove ALL of the gloss between coats, works really well on the curves.
I use a marine grade UV treated, gloss, polyurethane designed for hard wearing surfaces called "Weatherfast poly clear" made by "Norfast" for all of the build-up coats, usually 3-4 and then finish it off with a coat of satin to take the shine off. (Seems like such a shame sometimes) It's applied using a small gravity fed touch-up spray gun that holds up to 100 ml of product.

More to come.
Rob.
The shortest distance between two points is a FLATLINE
ImageEmail; robnicoll(at)bigpond(dot)com
www.flatlinebows.com.au

User avatar
bigbob
Posts: 4098
Joined: Sat Jul 10, 2010 8:55 pm
Location: sunshine coast

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#25 Post by bigbob » Mon Apr 22, 2013 7:34 pm

Dang Rob you've gone and gazumped me with that hairy oak. I am currently building a bow with hairy oak as belly veneers that's heading over seas.now its gunna look like I'm copying you!! :wink: :wink: :surprised: :surprised: :sad: :sad: :lol: :lol: :lol: Nice looking bow by the way, as always.
nil illigitimo in desperandum carborundum
razorbows.com

User avatar
hazard
Posts: 1516
Joined: Sun Jan 16, 2011 5:45 pm
Location: Maraylya

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#26 Post by hazard » Mon Apr 22, 2013 8:37 pm

You Ba$tard Rob!!

I go on a Cruise and you wait to post this right after I leave on the ship!!

I know you gave me the heads up but fair suck of the sav mate :wink: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Now back to business!! :shock:

You have a few interesting things I spotted there mate

"Female mould facing down" ok? I was told that ti is more difficult that way, cant really say havent tried it that way yet.I was told it makes the glue up a bit tricky.

Air tube,, I am not sure I noticed anything like that on your first build along before :roll:

Gluing the back lam into one length. I had this in mind for my next project too.

Your work shop is still a bit toooo clean mate! :wink:

Top work keep it up !! :mrgreen:

Hazard
Politics is a game played by dishonest people to gain an unfair advantage!

Never under estimate the strength of a cornered coward.

Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but some abuse the privilege.

http://www.bowmanstaxidermy.com.au
Image

User avatar
Flatliner
Posts: 449
Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:12 pm
Location: Gordonvale NTH QLD

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#27 Post by Flatliner » Tue Apr 23, 2013 11:49 am

bigbob wrote:Dang Rob you've gone and gazumped me with that hairy oak. I am currently building a bow with hairy oak as belly veneers that's heading over seas.now its gunna look like I'm copying you!! :wink: :wink: :surprised: :surprised: :sad: :sad: :lol: :lol: :lol: Nice looking bow by the way, as always.
Well Bob I don't mind admitting that I actualy stole the Hairy Oak/Conkerberry combo from one of your bows, though your's was Hairy Oak/Osage, but the colours are similar, great mix, thanks Bob.
hazard wrote:You Ba$tard Rob!!

I go on a Cruise and you wait to post this right after I leave on the ship!!

I know you gave me the heads up but fair suck of the sav mate :wink: :lol: :lol: :lol:
What the,,, you get back from a cruise and you're complaining,,,, jeese I wish I had problems like that :razz: :wink: .
hazard wrote:"Female mould facing down" ok? I was told that ti is more difficult that way, cant really say havent tried it that way yet.I was told it makes the glue up a bit tricky
I do it that way cause I work with the male part of the form clamped to the bench on upstands and it keeps the air hose (which is mentioned in the other build) above the glue drips instead of below where it can be a problem, it's hard to keep cling wrap in place with bends like that in your form.
hazard wrote:Your work shop is still a bit toooo clean mate!
Why do you think the photos are croped so close, outside the boarders of the pix it's pure mayhem.

Thanks to everyone for the positive coments, very gratifying.

Cheers, Rob.
The shortest distance between two points is a FLATLINE
ImageEmail; robnicoll(at)bigpond(dot)com
www.flatlinebows.com.au

User avatar
Flatliner
Posts: 449
Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:12 pm
Location: Gordonvale NTH QLD

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#28 Post by Flatliner » Tue Apr 23, 2013 12:05 pm

Back again.

After waiting four days for the final coat to dry a string and bear hair style strike plate and arrow rest are installed and it’s time to put it through the crono.
Twelve carbon arrows of 9 grains per pound of draw weight are shot and an average taken and this bow’s average speed is 190 FPS, not as fast as I was expecting but plenty fast enough.
The other side of the coin is while shooting those 12 arrows six at a time from 10 meters I managed to wreck fletches on three of them, the groups were so tight. So I’m more than happy with the bows performance. As often happens I’d really like to keep it but it’s already got Dave’s name on it.

Here are the photos of the finished bow.
SDC12501.JPG
SDC12501.JPG (94.16 KiB) Viewed 12424 times
SDC12503.JPG
SDC12503.JPG (75.92 KiB) Viewed 12424 times
SDC12505.JPG
SDC12505.JPG (76.83 KiB) Viewed 12424 times
SDC12506.JPG
SDC12506.JPG (93.84 KiB) Viewed 12424 times
SDC12512.JPG
SDC12512.JPG (124.16 KiB) Viewed 12424 times
SDC12516.JPG
SDC12516.JPG (156.98 KiB) Viewed 12424 times
SDC12519.JPG
SDC12519.JPG (144.13 KiB) Viewed 12424 times
SDC12530.JPG
SDC12530.JPG (105.26 KiB) Viewed 12424 times
SDC12537.JPG
SDC12537.JPG (63.06 KiB) Viewed 12424 times
SDC12541.JPG
SDC12541.JPG (57.34 KiB) Viewed 12424 times
I hope this build has given you all a few tips and a bit of inspiration to have a go your selves, there are many small challenges along the way but great reward in creating an attractive functional hunting tool by your own hand.

Cheers, Rob.
The shortest distance between two points is a FLATLINE
ImageEmail; robnicoll(at)bigpond(dot)com
www.flatlinebows.com.au

User avatar
bigbob
Posts: 4098
Joined: Sat Jul 10, 2010 8:55 pm
Location: sunshine coast

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#29 Post by bigbob » Tue Apr 23, 2013 6:03 pm

That is one seriously nice bow Rob and you are allowed to 'steal' ideas :wink: :biggrin: don't we all. I am constantly on the net trawling for ideas which is why I will be off line for couple days as I have to get a virus removed from computer. Its affecting my eBay page. Dirty @#$%^$%! Why cant the scum get a real job instead of harassing ordinary folk like myself.
nil illigitimo in desperandum carborundum
razorbows.com

slvrslngr
Posts: 199
Joined: Sun Nov 08, 2009 10:47 am
Location: SoCal

Re: Flatline Raptor one piece recurve build-along

#30 Post by slvrslngr » Tue Apr 23, 2013 6:47 pm

Another functional work of art and a really informative post to see how it all comes together! Thanks for taking the time to show us the process.

Post Reply