making my first set of woods, a couple of Q's

[muntries]

I'm finally having a crack at making my own Port Orford arrows, I have my varios clipper, nocks and points and my taper tool and I'm ready to have a go.

But I have a couple of questions before I start chopping and tapering. Should I cut the shafts longer than I would normally and then tune them and cut until they're shooting ok or would it be ok to cut to the same length that works well for my carbons? Also can someone recommend a product to seal them, was thinking waterbased but worried about raising grain and that affecting the integrity of the shafts.

[Nephew]

I start at full length, but take an inch for the first cut, half inch for the next, then go smaller from there, the last one or two being 1/8th of an inch (4mm), and use Cabothane for sealing( A 250ml can is about $10 and you'll get plenty of dozens of shafts sealed out of it at 5 coats per shaft) Others may have better methods though, I'm pretty new to it myself but have successfully made a few sets now. The best tip I ever got was to use shafts rated 10-15 pounds higher than your bows draw weight. Why it works I have no idea, but it does. Depending on the wood , when I try with shafts rated exactly right for my bow I end up with a very short shaft I can't use!! I hope this helps, Bud.

[muntries]

wish I had asked before I ordered the shafts, ah well all a learning process. I'll have a crack and see where it gets me. What about adhesive on the points? Would need to be something that can be removed each time I'm cutting down wouldn't it?

[Nephew]

I never use adhesive when tuning, mate. The point seems to fit snugly enough 0n the taper to not worry about it, BUT, my targets are just those plastic-like stripey bags from Crazy Clarkes full of rags. More sturdy material may require gluing. Maybe hot melt? BTW, what works for me may not for you, a bit like gardening. You may find shafts rated exactly right are perfect for your style of shooting. Any advice given should only be treated as a general guide, you'll find your own way and technique that works just right for you soon enough, old mate.
Oh yeah, JCM at Amso128 might have some threaded field points in your size. They don't require glue, and come off (when you want them to) relatively easily. I have some in 5/16ths I'm not using, if you can use 'em P.M. me your address and I'll mail half a dozen your way if you like.

[Stickbow Hunter]

I make all my arras to set lengths as I don't see any sense in having sets of arras each a different length ( I know the spine weights I need for my bows).

I would suggest that you straighten all the shafts first and then taper the nock ends and test fit your nocks (no glue) to check they all align properly; if you have one that is out you can cut the shaft a bit and do the taper again.
You then take a shaft and dry fit a nock and measure the length from the deepest part of the throat of the nock to the length you want the shaft to the back of the head (point).
You then add say 1.25" for the point taper and cut your shaft.
Taper the point and fit your arra point and check the length again as above.
If you find the arra measures a bit long to the back of the point cut the amount it is too long off the point taper and do the taper again and fit the point - the length should now be right.
You can then cut all the other shafts to that length and taper the point ends.

I hope that make sense.

I use normal varnish but the water base finishes seem to work fine.

All the best and take some photos to show us when you're done.

Jeff

[Nephew]

Yes, straightening and rechecking during the process is a good idea. I just didn't say anything because it's simple common sense that should go without saying.
( Some might say I simply forgot about it, but the common sense thing is my story and I'm sticking to it! )

See what I mean, though? There's two different techniques and both work well for their respective users. Jeff taught me how to do it, and I adapted my own methods once I was confident I wouldn't bugger it up. He doesn't bare shaft tune at all! ( I reckon he's mad, but don't tell him that! )
If and when you choose to bare shaft, just leave them a little bit the light side of perfect as the fletching stiffens them considerably. That's my experience, anyway.

[Jaydo]

you shooting woods out of the attila moreton. ?

not sure if it would like that...

muntries, best advice i ever got was buy half a dozen shafts, two of each spine up and down and bang on your poundage, one in 5/16 and the other in 11/32, bareshaft with them untill you find what flies best, and write down all the info, from there you can make arrows the same, you will probably find that unless you spine test them yourself you'll have differences in weight and spine in a set as well, but its how far and how picky you want to get,

as for sealing them i always used clear varnish like an estapol spray or something like that, even coats and wont affect the fletching glue,

lots of fun making wood arrows, i took the easy way and used carbons

[MarkG]

Most important is to make sure your nock is across the grain. That way the arrow has less chance of splitting down the grain of the wood and all your arrows will be spined the same. Different sides of an arrow will have different spine.

[Nephew]

you shooting woods out of the attila moreton. ?

not sure if it would like that...

Mate, it's wood itself! It would a be a woodist hypocrite to not like 'em!
Nah, it loves 'em!! I'm shooting Bunya Pine at 23/64ths, spine rated at 64-69# and 28 & 1/4" to back of point and it just EATS 'em alive!

[Dodger]

I know the spine weights I need for my bows).

Hi Jeff, which wood and what spine weight do you use? Am I right to assume that different woods would spine differently? Also, what length do you cut your shafts to?

Thanks.

Dodger

[Gilly]

You will change the spine by cutting the length but you can also change it by using different weights of head, it can get confusing!

I would suggest getting in touch with John Macdonald, I am sure he will be able to sort out what you need.

We use an oil based varnish in a dip tube, ours usually end up with 10-12 coats on, got the dip tube from JCM as well!

[Stickbow Hunter]

I will add that I agree with Jaydo that if you want to have your arras at a set length buying some test ones of various spines is a good idea.

Hi Jeff, which wood and what spine weight do you use? Am I right to assume that different woods would spine differently? Also, what length do you cut your shafts to?

Dodger,

At present I am using Victorian Ash shafts because I like heavy arras; my finished hunting arras usually end up around 725 grains. Yes, different woods do spine differently but so do shafts made from the same wood. I have a 26.5" draw and make my field arras 27" to back of point (BOP). My hunting arras I make 28" to BOP so the broadhead doesn't touch the index finger of my bow hand as I have it very close to my arra.

Jeff

[Dodger]

Thanks, Jeff.

What is the spine used on your hunting arrows?

[longbowinfected]

I stain my shafts and then later use a bees wax material I bought at the Gathering from a chap down the South Coast. Works beautifully. I have also used it on my bow.

If you use screw on adapters you can change point mass which means it iseasier to tune the arrow and to swap from field to blunts to broadheads of the same mass with basically the same aiming point which is pretty handy.

I use hotmelt, the archery type not the gun type from the cheapo stores but make sure I use a flame from a metho lamp that does not cause the point/shaft to go black. I aso cut grooves in the shaft to allow glue to press out and work the point to make sure there are no air pockets.

I do not have much overhang of the point as you lose energy.
You can ask for select shafts which are more expensive and further more highly specified. I know Port orfords come that way.

Recently I bought some Northern pine shafts from John McDonald made by one of Europes best shaft makers TAS Handles AG. They are some of the best shafts I have used in 7 years.

I went to John McDonalds and asked to weigh a very large number of shafts. He ordinarily spines them in 5 pound groups at full length [31 inches normally]. I asked for and he gave me about 8 dozen that had the draw weight /spine that I wanted [within 5 pounds]. I first sorted these by the mass I wanted, knowing my other component masses and by testing what the average mass of the removed timber would be as I will shorten them by 2.5 inches. From that 8 dozen I selected 4 dozen that spine exactly in the middle of the spining group. I handed the rest back to John. Using his whiz bang spining machine certainly made the task easier and john threatened me with Tim Tams during the process....I only had one, really.

At the end of the day the shafts were within 5 grains and spined within 3 pounds after cutting at home. Then I checked for absolute straightness, made the necessary arrow nock taper, slightly bevelled the front end to receive the adapters as well as compacting that area with a special pair of compression pliers and then sanded with stainless steel wool so that every shaft was the same mass.

Matching everything from the go get really tweeks arrow performance later.

I stained them then used contact paper to crest them. I am allergic to paints of all kinds, even water based. I crest them out ofrespect for thosewho spendtime making beautiful arrows. I also use the contact as it minimizes different chemicals from different pieces of timber from affecting the feather attachment using adhesive strips in a straight alignment.

No pix.
Only part of the story but a little different to he eal arrow artists.
I am more concerned with performance than looks [although that is getting better] and I recognise that an arrow is doomed to die rom the minute it is born.

A lot of people like Jeff and others have posted complete manuals on how to.
In my view well made wood arrows do not limit a good archer with good form.

They certainly feel great off the bow and are worth the effort....and it certainly does feel good making something with your own hands even if there are limits to your capacity.

Kev

[Stickbow Hunter]

What is the spine used on your hunting arrows?

My bow is 59# at my draw and I use 70 - 75pound spine arra shafts.

Jeff

[GrahameA]

Hi All.

My opinions on Arrows.

Over the last few years I think every question that can be asked about wood arrows has a been asked on This forum - and been answered. So these are my suggestions.

Before investing a small fortune in arrows make certain your draw length haas stabilized. You would not be happy if a couple of months after buying them you discover that your arrows were wrong for you.

Good arrows are not cheap. It does matter if you buy them or make them they will cost.

If you want to make arrows that fly well it helps to understand a little about what influences arrow flight and why. There is heaps of information on arrows on the web - not all of it correct.

You have a choice of making your own shafts, buying pre-made shafts or a mixture. It is easier to buy pre-made shafts, making your own gives you exactly what you want. One cost you money, the other costs you time.

Shafts from John McDonald are great value for money, shaft from Steve Wallace are even better but you will pay more as every shaft is hand made.

Build a series of arrows of varying spine weights/point weights that cover the likely range of arrows you will ever need. Use them as test arrows and to find what shoots best out of your bow.

Order the components from John and build a dozen arrows.. You can then start Dow a long and winding road.

A final comment if you ask the question about arrows and someone say's do "x" without expelling why ask them. You need to be able to separate facts from opinions.

[Dodger]

Thanks, Jeff. As you know, I will be using a similar draw weight to yours in future, hence the question.
Making my own arrows is something I will enjoy doing.

[muntries]

Thanks everyone, sorry I haven't been to this post for a few days but just been busy with the kids etc.

Jeff, on the straightening issue, how straight? I have one shaft thats looking a bit more like my bow and that will certainly need bending, the others are just ever so slightly bent (and some don't appear bent at all), almost hardly noticeable until I put them on the work top.

Craig, thanks for the offer for those points. I'll have a crack at tuning with these points I have but if they're not staying in then I might PM you about yours. What grain are they?

Kev, I like the idea of beeswax but how is that with paint?

Those screw in adapters sound like a great idea and wish I had known about them before I bought these, should have asked before I ordered I guess.

Cheers

Simon