Improving arrow cresting...

Where to source materials etc. Also the place to show off your new bow or quiver etc.... Making things belongs in Traditional Crafts.

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CameronPotter
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Improving arrow cresting...

#1 Post by CameronPotter » Mon Aug 22, 2005 10:45 am

Hi guys,

I thought that I would post this to ask a few questions and to give a few hints to anyone who might want to do this... My questions are in bold, the rest is in normal font.

I have found that when cresting, the paint dries very quickly (as the paint is going on at a reasonably high speed). This allows thin and even coverage. The problem is that to get enough paint on there, you need to get a lot of paint on your brush. Do you guys thin your paints at all? I am using modelling acryllics. They look very nice, but I find that I need to have a little blob on the end of my brush to get enough paint onto the shaft.

I have found that regardless of how much I try to straighten the arrows, there is still a little wobble. One thing I have found that works very well is to have the brush pressed against the shaft so that rather than having just the tip touching, I have the brush bending around the shaft a bit. This means that as the shaft moves in and out slightly, the brush handles it. This is of course only capable with a thin brush. The idea is that the bristles are always splayed to the maximum width regardless of how the shaft might wobble slightly. Has anyone else done this before?

I might note here that I am using Vic Ash shafts. They are pretty straight, but not dead straight and trying to straighten them is fairly difficult.

Cutting the nock taper first (if you are doing it that way) makes the shafting easier as then you can check the point of the taper to centre the shaft in the tubing on the cresting jig.

Make sure that you have your cresting jig be variable speed!!! It is absolutely terrific.

When doing your first coat of varnish, make sure that the varnish is thick enough (do multiple coats if necessary) to fill in the fissures in the wood's surface.

Learn from me - a dark coloured dip/spray is harder to use than a light coloured one. Mine was black - it meant that for my read and blue lines, I needed to do a white undercoat.

If any of the more experienced guys can point out where I might improve/have any tricks and tips - please feel free to impart your knowledge!

Lastly, have fun - it is really great. Also, have plenty of shafts to play with as you might find it kind of addictive. :roll:

Cam

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Buford
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#2 Post by Buford » Mon Aug 22, 2005 2:27 pm

Cam,
Can't say I have had too much trouble with paints drying too quick? :?
must be the cold temps down there in Tassie eh? :D

What I have found is having too much paint on the brush will give you big, thick wobbly lines, if it all comes off in a rush. :x

I don't thin paints for cresting. I used to thin my paints for capping but now that I use spray, I don't/ can't.

getting a shaft dead straight is hard and as to getting around that for cresting, Jeff has the technique that works best. Put the point end of the arrow in the cresting machine and slide the V block right up next to where your cresting at the other end. I also apply a little preasure on the shaft over the V block to further minimise movement.
One thing I have found that works very well is to have the brush pressed against the shaft so that rather than having just the tip touching, I have the brush bending around the shaft a bit. This means that as the shaft moves in and out slightly, the brush handles it.
be careful no to apply too much preasure when doing this or you can get the same results as putting too much paint on the brush.
What kind of brush are you using?
A quality needle point brush like the one I use (see below) should give good results without the need for overloading it with paint.
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CameronPotter
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#3 Post by CameronPotter » Mon Aug 22, 2005 2:35 pm

Thanks Matt,

I do put the rest right beside where I am cresting, but the motor stops if I apply any downwards pressure to the shaft.

I am using a wide flat brush, a 0 and a 3/0. I haven't really bothered using my 5/0 yet.

The technique you highlighted below actually works very well - for me. It ends up with a perfect line. However, rather than looking like it was done with a 0 brush, it looks more like a 1 or 2... Thus, you need to consider this when selecting a brush. What do you use to weigh down the shaft?

Cam

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Buford
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#4 Post by Buford » Mon Aug 22, 2005 2:41 pm

either light preasure from my pinky or i have a small felt bag filled with rice.
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#5 Post by CameronPotter » Mon Aug 22, 2005 2:51 pm

I might try to rice bag. My fingers (even a light touch) tend to stop the motor. Yes, it is obviously the least powerful sewing machine motor in the world...

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Hood
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#6 Post by Hood » Mon Aug 22, 2005 3:41 pm

So what paints work best I had a look at a few today, got confused so thought I'd ask before buying any.

Whats best? Acrylic hobby paints or enamel model paints?????? :?
And what clear finish works best? :?:
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#7 Post by CameronPotter » Mon Aug 22, 2005 3:46 pm

I am using marine grade varnish and acrylics. Acrylics because they don't stink, marine grade varnish because it is tough.

Cam

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Hood
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#8 Post by Hood » Mon Aug 22, 2005 3:56 pm

Thanks cam, I can get some 15ml bottles of acrylic paints for $2 each.
Seeya going shopping :D
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#9 Post by CameronPotter » Mon Aug 22, 2005 4:03 pm

Whoa! Make sure that you varnish the shafts before cresting them. I am told that this is necessary to stop bleeding.

Cam

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Buford
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#10 Post by Buford » Mon Aug 22, 2005 4:58 pm

you were told correct. :wink:
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Mick Smith
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#11 Post by Mick Smith » Mon Aug 22, 2005 7:44 pm

Cam

I've tried using acrylic paints in the past, but I didn't like they way worked. The colours don't cover well at all unless the undercoat is almost the same colour. I didn't like the texture either. I thought it dried too thick. Either I had wishy washy colours or paint piled on too thick.

I decided to use the little enamel cans made by Humbrol. They are used to paint models. This paint covers like a dream and is great to use, however it doesn't like being covered with a clear lacquer, as it will often bubble up. I just leave it as the top coating on the shaft. It wears very well because it's a lot tougher than acrylic paint.

Like Matt suggested you definitely need a "V" block to steady your shaft. I made my "V" block slightly too high, so the shaft has to bend slightly to go through it. The result is a rock steady shaft everytime. You do need a reasonably powerful motor to ensure the revs are maintained. I use my electric vari-speed drill and its works perfectly.

Good luck with your cresting mate! :wink:

Mick
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#12 Post by CameronPotter » Tue Aug 23, 2005 9:09 am

Thanks Mick,

I will consider the enamels. Interesting about the paint bubbling up after varnishing...

I certainly do have a V block, there is no way the shaft would be supported otherwise, but it still has a little wobble to it - not much but a little.

I think my V block is a little too high, but maybe it needs to be a little higher still... Hmmm.

Anyway, thanks for the tip regarding enamels - only my girlfriend wouldn't let me use enamels inside the house 'cause they stink... :?

The troubles we have to go through!! :lol:

Cam

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Buford
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#13 Post by Buford » Tue Aug 23, 2005 9:51 am

thats easy fixed Cam.... put her out side till your done. :P :lol:
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#14 Post by CameronPotter » Tue Aug 23, 2005 9:57 am

Ahhh, but she hasn't been to obedience school and doesn't understand the stay command. Actually - I think she sent me to obedience school while I wasn't aware. Maybe she plays tapes at night to get into my subconscious:

"Listen to me or I will give you hell..."

"You must obey me. It is the natural order of things..."

and then I wake up the next day and do as she says!

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Actually to be fair, she allows all kinds of garbage all over the house and doesn't flinch too much at expesnive tool purchases. But nasty chemical smells are where she draws the line.

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#15 Post by Buford » Tue Aug 23, 2005 10:15 am

yeah, you trained good. :P :D
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clinglish
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#16 Post by clinglish » Tue Aug 23, 2005 7:23 pm

Hi , I have video you can borrow if you like. It covers some good aspects including setup and such . You just have to cover postage.

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#17 Post by timbo » Tue Aug 23, 2005 9:54 pm

Gees Cam why don't you buy her some nice fingernail polish!! Can't smell any worse then the enamel. :D And you might get some brownie points for thinking about her without being prompted :wink:

Just a thought.

Cheers Tim
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#18 Post by Hood » Tue Aug 23, 2005 10:03 pm

timbo wrote:Gees Cam why don't you buy her some nice fingernail polish!! Can't smell any worse then the enamel. :D And you might get some brownie points for thinking about her without being prompted :wink:

Just a thought.

Cheers Tim
Yeah but it doesn't help any if he gets the wrong colour :lol:

Thats so true the females don't complain about the fumes from their nail polish, BUT when it came to me staining my wood shafts at the table tonight boy did ..it hit the fan when she came out into the dining room and smelt it :x talk about double standards.
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#19 Post by CameronPotter » Wed Aug 24, 2005 9:39 am

Actually she doesn't use fingernail polish for that reason!

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#20 Post by Hood » Wed Aug 24, 2005 11:23 am

CameronPotter wrote:Actually she doesn't use fingernail polish for that reason!
Sorry you loose then. Get a heater in your shed then.
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#21 Post by CameronPotter » Wed Aug 24, 2005 11:36 am

Yep. I know I lose. I am presently looking at getting a decent sized shed (one that might fit me and tools in at the same time).

That one will definitely include a heater.

Cam

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Buford
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#22 Post by Buford » Wed Aug 24, 2005 11:53 am

what kind of paint are you using that smells that much? :?
All the model paints I have ever used hardly have an odor at all.
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#23 Post by CameronPotter » Wed Aug 24, 2005 12:09 pm

That is the point. I am not using enamels, so they don't smell. I am using acrylics (I think that they are Tamiya brand).

They work perfectly well for me - other than drying out quickly (which is also sort of a good thing as by the time I am done with one set of lines, I am ready for the next as the arrow shaft is dry.

Cam

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Hood
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#24 Post by Hood » Wed Aug 24, 2005 1:38 pm

I just bought some Humbrol enamel model paints yesterday from BigW for $2 each. In the model shop they were trying to flog the same size tin (small) for $5-$6 each :evil:

Here's a mocked up prototype of what my arrows will/should look like once finished.
The colours are white, orange, black and silver with the shafts stained with FeastWatson Prooftint "Cedar"
5" parabolic orange feathers (will get a shield cutter next time)
I'm still undecided on the broadhead to use, am tossing up between the tusker concord or the ribbies :?

Image

Image
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#25 Post by Mick Smith » Wed Aug 24, 2005 4:26 pm

Mick

For some reason your photos didn't come out. I'd love to see your arrows. :D

Mick
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#26 Post by Hood » Wed Aug 24, 2005 5:47 pm

Mick Smith wrote:Mick

For some reason your photos didn't come out. I'd love to see your arrows. :D

Mick
I can see them, what about anyone else???
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#27 Post by Buford » Wed Aug 24, 2005 5:49 pm

i can now... couldn't before. Looking good mate :wink:
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#28 Post by Hood » Wed Aug 24, 2005 5:51 pm

Thanks matt :D
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Mick Smith
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#29 Post by Mick Smith » Wed Aug 24, 2005 7:53 pm

Mick

Your first timber arrows are going to look great. 8)

Mick
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#30 Post by Hood » Wed Aug 24, 2005 8:37 pm

Thanks mick, but that is only if it all goes according to plan..........plan what plan no one told me I needed a plan :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Hope to start the cresting this weekend.
Bow Hunting is my Passion.

My wife says it's my Obsession.

Either way I'm happy.

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