Horn for arrow nocks

[Fraser]

Hi guys, does any one know of an Australian supplier of horn for arrow self nocks?

Fraser.

[WOLF]

I used to get mine from Wildwood Traditional Archery but they have now closed business they were here in Aust
I get all my horn products for doing arrows from The Longbow Shop. They are in England but very prompt,I put an order in on
the 4th of Feb and got package this morning 12th Cant complain.
here is a link to the Horn Strip you are looking for

http://www.thelongbowshop.com/products/ ... nocks.html

Cheers
Neil

[Fraser]

Thanks Neil, looks like I might be sending off to UK for them.

Fraser.

[Stickbow Hunter]

Any abattoirs up your way mate? If so it might be worth asking about some horns.

Jeff

[Fraser]

There's one a Sarina Jeff, I'll see if I can get some from them. I assume I would have to dry them out, maybe boil the flesh off first?

Fraser.

[Stickbow Hunter]

Give'm a try mate. Not all cattle are dehorned so you might just get some if you can manage to talk to someone other than the office girl.

Jeff

[rodlonq]

Hi Fraser,

If you don't do any good with the abattoir you could try this fella on ebay.

I bought some of them with a bundle of bamboo shafts. I haven't made any horn reinforced self nocks yet (used plastic ) but the horn slivers look OK to me.

http://stores.ebay.com.au/first-bird-ba ... ml?_fsub=1

Cheers...... Rod

[rmcpb]

Know any farmers up your way. When they are knocking the horns off maybe they will keep a few for you??

[Fraser]

Thanks guys, the only farmers I know up here are cane farmers unfortunately. eBay site looks alright Rod.

Fraser

[greybeard]

Hi Fraser,

A friend of mine takes my unwanted off cuts of .040” glass laminations for this purpose. He glues two strips together and then cuts his inserts across the strip so the glass fibres are running across the insert.

You could laminate more strips for extra thickness.

Daryl.

[Fraser]

Hi Daryl, do you think PVC, acrylic, or PE would work?

Fraser.

[greybeard]

Hi Fraser,

I have not heard of anyone using those materials.

Phenolic strips from Bingham’s may be an alternative. The price appears to be reasonable for the yield.

Phenolic Strips.jpg (40.66 KiB) Viewed 5722 times

Daryl.

[Fraser]

Thanks Daryl,

Fraser,

[GrahameA]

Afternoon

There's one a Sarina Jeff, I'll see if I can get some from them. I assume I would have to dry them out, maybe boil the flesh off first?

You can cut slivers from the thick ends of horns.

You can remove the solid ends, cut a slit and then boil the horns to soften them and then flatten by clamping them between two wood flats. You need a big clamp or vice.

You can use printed circuit board for inserts, So you could drop into Jaycar, buy a piece of circuit board, remove the copper surface material, them slice it up.

[rodlonq]

Would bone work? Have a feed of BBQ ribs and get some nock reinforcing material at the same time

Cheers..... Rod

[Fraser]

I had no luck with the meat works, I do have a piece of rib that I have been meaning to try, it might work, but getting a piece big enough (ie no marrow and flat enough) will be the trick. Might try some plastic products, circut boards, HDPE, etc.

Fraser

[GrahameA]

Afternoon Frase.

... Might try some plastic products, circut boards, HDPE, etc.

Will you please clarify what you are trying to do.

Are you trying to make some "Horn Reinforced Nocks" or are you trying to make arrows with Horn Nocks?

If you want to make reinforced nocks you can use Horn or a number of other material or even hardwood. Plastic a poor choice as if does not bond well to the timber

If you want Horn Nocks then http://www.3riversarchery.com/Primitive ... eitem.html
or
You can fit a piece of Horn or Hardwood into the end of shaft like you were footing the shaft. This will not be be fast . You will need to cut a "V" in the end of the shaft and then cut a matching "V" into the piece you are splicing in.

https://sites.google.com/site/amyextras ... dieval_hyw
The attached is of arrows with reinforced nocks. There is a piece of Horn inserted into the shaft at 90deg to the nock (It appear as a dark line on the shaft).

[greybeard]

Hi Grahame,

Google has got your photo.

https://cd0eccc0-a-62cb3a1a-s-sites.goo ... edirects=0
The attached is of arrows with reinforced nocks. There is a piece of Horn inserted into the shaft at 90deg to the nock (It appear as a dark line on the shaft).

Daryl.

[GrahameA]

Hi Daryl

Hi Grahame,
Google has got your photo.

Curse you Google. Fixed with a link to the page.

[rodlonq]

Hi Grahame,

Google has got your photo.

....... There is a piece of Horn inserted into the shaft at 90deg to the nock (It appear as a dark line on the shaft).

Daryl.

Like this? I cant remember the exact source but it is a UK fletcher. His arras are top notch. I need to try this one day with some horn. I did an insert of hardwood into a pice of dowel as an experiment and it worked, just too lazy to take the next step

BuffHornNock1.jpg (29.39 KiB) Viewed 5695 times

Cheers...... Rod

[rodlonq]

Perhaps you could make your own micarta from denim or an old work shirt, whatever really.

I made some from Auscam material. From memory 16 layers made around 1/4" thick micarta. You'd only need 6 or 7 layers to make slivers for reinforced nocks.

P7040032.JPG (85.04 KiB) Viewed 5694 times

AuscamMicarta.jpg (61.52 KiB) Viewed 5694 times

If you get the thickness and the width of the strip right then all you need to do is cut them wide enough to suit your shafts.

Cheers..... Rod

[GrahameA]

Hi Rod

Like this. I cant remember the exact source but it is a UK fletcher. His arras are top notch. I need to try this one day

BuffHornNock1.jpg

That has been done by this method :

You can fit a piece of Horn or Hardwood into the end of shaft like you were footing the shaft. This will not be be fast . You will need to cut a "V" in the end of the shaft and then cut a matching "V" into the piece you are splicing in.

Works well, takes lots of time. I will drag some arrows out from downstairs and take a couple of photos. 3Rivers used to sell small Horn Pieces especially to do that but they no longer appear in their catalogue.

[rodlonq]

Hi Rod

Like this. I cant remember the exact source but it is a UK fletcher. His arras are top notch. I need to try this one day

BuffHornNock1.jpg

That has been done by this method :

You can fit a piece of Horn or Hardwood into the end of shaft like you were footing the shaft. This will not be be fast . You will need to cut a "V" in the end of the shaft and then cut a matching "V" into the piece you are splicing in.

Works well, takes lots of time. I will drag some arrows out from downstairs and take a couple of photos. 3Rivers used to sell small Horn Pieces especially to do that but they no longer appear in their catalogue.

Hi Grahame,

In the first post Fraser asked for horn for 'self nocks' so I immediately assumed he is wanting to make some horn reinforced nocks. The horn nocks from 3 Rivers (a few posts back) would not fit the self nock description would they?

I think it would it be possible to just do a straight narrow cut in the end of the shaft and so long as the insert has enough taper it would bend the remaining shaft to suit. The end of the insert would need to be the same thickness as the width of the bottom of the saw cut to get a nice clean finish with fine glue lines. A bit like the wings on a four wing footing spread open to fit over the prepared shaft.

In fact, if you look closely at the photo of the vee shaped insert you can see the grain follows the insert. It doesn't look like a vee has been cut from the shaft, just a single saw cut.

Cheers...... Rod

[Fraser]

Grahame, I just want to make horn reinforced self nocks, the style used in arrows for a warbow. The shafts in question are mountain ash, but the poundage of the bow is little on the high side, I'm Unsure whether the timber shaft would stand up to it without reinforcement.

Rod what glue did you use to the micarta?

Fraser

[rodlonq]

I used Techniglue Fraser. I think you would need a strong epoxy to make good micarta. I kept the jig and so on small enough so I could put it in the oven to cure properly. It is very strong stuff, however best to do this while the missus is away cos it stinks up the kitchen a bit.....

GearForMicarta.JPG (154.43 KiB) Viewed 5684 times

Curing Micarta.JPG (154.27 KiB) Viewed 5684 times

Cheers..... Rod

[Fraser]

No worries, I've got a outdoor gas oven. What temp do you cure it at?

Fraser.

[rodlonq]

65C for 2 hours. It probably is not that critical for this job, not like curing a bow....

Cheers.... Rod

[Fraser]

Thanks, looks like I'll have to sit out on the verander and keep turning the oven on and of, low flame is 120c

Fraser

[rodlonq]

Hi Fraser,

I think it may not even need heat curing, I may have put it in the oven just to accelerate the process. You would heat cure a bow to improve the properties of the resin, mainly the heat distortion temperature (HDT). You application is nowhere near as demanding and so you may not need to cure it. Perhaps someone with a lot more experience can help here. I have attached a data sheeet for Techniglue. Perhaps curing at 120C would be OK fort a short period of time but it may drive of some volatile chemicals that are necessary to the final product (and may be dangerous to humans). Perhaps just locking it in a car out in the sun would speed up the process bit make oyur car stink

Cheers..... Rod

tech_glue_r60.pdf

(80.08 KiB) Downloaded 62 times

[GrahameA]

Hi Rod/Fraser.

In the first post Fraser asked for horn for 'self nocks' so I immediately assumed he is wanting to make some horn reinforced nocks. The horn nocks from 3 Rivers (a few posts back) would not fit the self nock description would they?

I just wanted to clarify things as I have been caught before when people say one thing and mean something else.

I think it would it be possible to just do a straight narrow cut in the end of the shaft and so long as the insert has enough taper it would bend the remaining shaft to suit. The end of the insert would need to be the same thickness as the width of the bottom of the saw cut to get a nice clean finish with fine glue lines. A bit like the wings on a four wing footing spread open to fit over the prepared shaft.

In fact, if you look closely at the photo of the vee shaped insert you can see the grain follows the insert. It doesn't look like a vee has been cut from the shaft, just a single saw cut.

I have had a few fail by splitting the timber. So now I "V" the the shafts. It is easy to do with some sandpaper and a bit of judicous sanding - it just take time.

nock1.jpg (22.48 KiB) Viewed 5664 times

Grahame, I just want to make horn reinforced self nocks, the style used in arrows for a warbow. The shafts in question are mountain ash, but the poundage of the bow is little on the high side, I'm Unsure whether the timber shaft would stand up to it without reinforcement.

That is all good. You can bind the nock section with material to add extra support to the shaft. Works well and is surprisingly strong.

nock2.jpg (33.56 KiB) Viewed 5664 times

This the level of damage sustained when a 60lb Longbow Robin Hoods an arrow. The wings of the nock have bee broken off but the is very little damage to the shaft and no splitting.