Stotler GameGetter 70lb

[Fanto]

gday all

new bow arrived today, its a real beast 69# at 27in. we put it on the scale at the archery shop today and i drew it at 75#!

its not cut to centre like my recurves so it shoots the same arrows as the 60lb bow really well, i was surprised at how I shot it straight up- pretty well considering the 15lb jump.

ill post some pictures, this bow really is a nice piece of craftsmanship, i counted the layers, there is 8 in each limb - clear glass, timber, bamboo, bamboo, carbon, bamboo, timber, clear glass!!

we didn't chronograph an arrow but it was noticeably faster than the 60lb bows we were shooting.

it was not however more accurate that the 64in predator longbow the shop owner shoots. that bow is an absolute joy , so very very accurate its quite incredible

ill post some pictures

cheers

[Fraser]

Hi Fanto, good to see some one trying heavier bows. I recently got a new bow at 95lb, and like you I was suprised how easy it was to shoot. Just watch your fingers though, don't be afraid to change or pad out your glove. Sore fingers where my biggest issue.

Love to see some photos.

Cheers,

Fraser

[Stickbow Hunter]

Congrats on your new bow and I look forward to the photos.

it was not however more accurate that the 64in predator longbow the shop owner shoots. that bow is an absolute joy , so very very accurate its quite incredible

I think you will find that is to do with the shooter/s and not the bows.

Jeff

[Fanto]

Hi Jeff

I am not as good a shot as the shop owner when we shoot the same bow, but I did shoot the predator better than i have ever shot any other bow.

I imagine you are right and the problem is that I am inconsistent and my form isnt perfect, but the Predator was noticeably more accurate for me and the owner feels the same way about the bow compared to his many, many other bows.

cheers!

[Stickbow Hunter]

I understand what you are saying mate. If you put the bows in a shooting machine I'm sure one would shoot pretty much as accurately as the other. The Predator probably just suits you better with regards, draw weight, riser shape style and bow design which means you shoot it better. It isn't that the bow is more accurate, you just happen to click with it.

[Fanto]

agreed Jeff.

maybe this is going to open a can of worms, but do you have a view on whether Longbows are more forgiving and therefore able to deliver better consistency and accuracy compared to a Recurve when shot by, lets say, an "average" shooter who suffers from varying or slightly inconsistent form etc?

[GrahameA]

Afternoon.

You deserve this for bringing this topic up, again.

... this is going to open a can of worms, but do you have a view on whether Longbows are more forgiving ...

Define what you mean as forgiving and how you measure it? This will be good for a few replies.

[Buranurra]

HI Fanto,

Looking forward to seeing some pics of your new bow!

BTW. Was the Predator you used, the LoBo or the Phoenix Longbow? I think the lobo, is a hybrid, and the Phoenix has more of a strung D shape?

Cheers

Jase

[Fanto]

Grahame,

By forgiving I mean when I apply my shooting technique (warts and all), do groups of arrows which you shoot strike closer to each other and to the target when shot from a longbow as opposed to a recurve, other things being equal such as arrows are matched to each bow, same shooter, same draw weight etc.

Byron Ferguson said that longbows are more forgiving of poor form, specifically torquing the string because the tips resist bending side to side much more than recurve tips do.

Im not trying to win any arguments here, I really dont have an opinion, I just think its an interesting Topic

Buranurra

It was a pheonix. Ive got half a mind to order one, the shop owner wants my Hunter 60lb recurve so its half paid for already!

cheers

[Stickbow Hunter]

maybe this is going to open a can of worms, but do you have a view on whether Longbows are more forgiving and therefore able to deliver better consistency and accuracy compared to a Recurve when shot by, lets say, an "average" shooter who suffers from varying or slightly inconsistent form etc?

Well I never got to reply in the other thread about string follow bows which contained a debate on this subject. I just didn't take the time to sit down and reply. I don't have time to get into too much detail now either but I will offer the following. Also note that I have been shooting longbows for over 28 yrs and have rarely shot recurves so my observations are probably different to those who shoot both or just shoot recurves..

I disagree with my good mate Dennis La Varenne and GrahameA and others that say you must be able to measure something or it isn't valid. Some things just can't be measured, or at least I have no idea how you could but it doesn't IMO mean I am looney (though some may disagree ) and I don't actually feel the things I observe happening when I shoot.

It may not be measurable but I find different bow designs feel vastly different to shoot. Longbows (I mean long straight limbed, small riser bows not the semi-recurves many call longbows now days) and self bows to me all have a felt bump when shot. This to me is because there is not much mass in the riser of the bow to help absorb any left over stored energy that is not used in pushing the arrow. Recurves I have shot don't have this small bump but their limbs seem to wobble and vibrate after the shot where a longbows doesn't.

With most all longbows I can feel the riser bend (flex) slightly in my bow hand where Dennis and other people have said to me they can't feel it. How you could measure such a very small flex I have no idea but I know I can feel it; a lot more so in some bows then others.

Another thing I noticed back in the early 1990's when I changed from shooting 68" longbows to 66" ones. I did this to get better performance from my set up for hunting as I have a short 26.5" draw length. The very first thing I noticed was how twitchy (unstable) the shorter bow was compared to the longer bows. Only TWO inches but the difference was very noticeable. There is no doubt whatsoever about my observations but how do you measure it? I don't have a clue. I did notice GrahameA mentioned something about gyro something or other in a couple of his posts so it may have something to do with that. All I know is that the shorter bow seemed to move (rotate) a little which to me made the bow more unstable to shoot and I had to concentrate more on my form to stop this. It is no longer a problem but certainly was when I first changed over. I will add in those times I shot a lot and was quite an accomplished shot with a longbow.

As mentioned above, I haven't shot recurves much but when I have, I have found them to be more twitchy to shoot and more critical of form. To me they were much less forgiving of a bad release or a movement of my bow arm then when shooting my longbows. By this I mean I would miss on such occasions by a larger degree than with my longbows. For this reason I find a recurve far less forgiving of form errors than my longbows.

So to answer your question - I've already opened that can of worms - to me a longbow is more stable to shoot and more forgiving of my form errors than a recurve. However if I had shot recurves as long as I have longbows my observations may be different.

Can any of my observations be measured, I don't think so but I stand by them.

Jeff

[Fanto]

Jeff

I was wondering what you were going to say about this, I thought i was going to get shot down for a minute there!!

Its all good fun. I like shooting lots of bows, different bows. its a challenge.

Ive never shot a bow as well as I shot that Predator 64' longbow. you know those black foam block targets with the 5 small yellow diamonds? they are about 50mmx50mm. I shot 5 arrows at the 5 diamonds and hit 4, missed the other one by half an inch, at 20 yards. Id only shot half a dozen arrows with the bow prior to those 5. I have never shot that well with one of my bows.


cheers

[Benny Nganabbarru]

Dennis Kamstra shoots a Stotler, I think.

[GrahameA]

Afternoon All.

I was wondering what you were going to say about this, I thought i was going to get shot ...

You still are for mentioning "forgiving".

Think of the bow more like a flywheel. The longer you make the limbs the harder it is to rotate the bow. about the Z - axis. If you add a Longrod then it makes it harder to rotate around the X - Axis.

All things being equal a longer bow will be a more stable shooting platform.

Similarly, increasing tha mass of the riser increase its inertia and the stability oF the shooting platform. Remember there are no free lunches and thus the Logbow will shoot a little slower. What do you want?? A slow hit or a fast miss?

[Buranurra]

Hi Fanto,

Colour me green if you get that Predator

Cheers

Jase

[wishsong]

Congrats on the new bow ..

as for forgiving ... I am with Jeff on this one and a search of prev threads will show my opinion is in line with his ...

But I'd also add that I have read previously that the thinner longbow limb experiences less oscillation at release than the wider thinner recurve limb, hence the "forgiveness"/stability .... may have been Mike Palmer or Bob Lee that said it ... Sid at Border has said much the same thing re torsional stability , as has I believe Larry Hatfield .

But in my uber scientific experiments , roving , stumping and hunting I hit stuff more regularly with longbows than I do with 'curves

[Fanto]

Hi Fanto,

Colour me green if you get that Predator

Cheers

Jase

Says he the owner of a Predator and who is one month closer to a Saluki than any other saluki wannabe alive..

[Buranurra]

Hi Fanto,

Colour me green if you get that Predator

Cheers

Jase

Says he the owner of a Predator and who is one month closer to a Saluki than any other saluki wannabe alive..

Ha ha, yeah ... but I have at least 11 months to wait before I see that bow and I currently have only one bow , I also have been lusting after longbows recently. Anyway, congrats on the Stotler. I hope you get the Predator too mate

[Fanto]

A few pictures of the bow in question

[Buranurra]

Nice bow mate.

Have you thought about changing the string over to a D97?

Cheers

Jase

[Fanto]

Jase

thanks.

I just made that FastFlight string yesterday, so no I havent thought about changing to D97! is that what you use? is it good?


the string is 16 strand, 2 bundle packed at the loops. it was a good nock fit, just needed 2 layers of dental floss to sure it up, its very quiet, the performance is blistering with a 600gr arrow.

[Buranurra]

Hi mate,

I didn't realise it was FF, so no I probably wouldn't bother changing it. I have D97 flemish twist on my Predator and I am pretty sure the Predator Longbows come with the same.

Others here will have infinitely better knowledge and advice to offer than I.

Cheers

Jase

[Stickbow Hunter]

Thanks for the photos. They have a rather wide limb on them; do you know what the width is?

I notice your dental floss wrapped around your serving. I serve the string nock area on my string first with the dental floss and then serve as normal over it. That way it is hidden and doesn't get worn by the arra nocks.

Jeff

[Fanto]

gday Jeff

thanks for the tip on the dental floss! ill try that. Id like to have a go at a 3 bundle so ill try on that.

as for the limb width, its a few milimetres wider that the Martin Hunter limbs which are 43mm from memory, so that puts them at around 45-46mm. ill measure them and let you know.

cheers

p.s. the Mamba limb tips i repaired with the bo-tuff you sent are great, did I ever send a picture of that repair? I must have shot a thousand arrows with that bow and there is no sign of any movement. Im sticking to B-50 just to be on the safe side through

[Stickbow Hunter]

Those are wide limbs then. Thanks.

Jeff