joining clubs and organisations.

[morganp]

I have asked this before but wasn't clear and didn't get clear answers. My fault, so I will try again here as many travel around a lot.
Background: I have been shooting longbow and recurve on and off for fifty years, never competed or joined a club or taken large game with bow but I know the basics. Because of various injury forced down to really light poundage, 30lb is max at present.

I decided I would like to travel to some of the meetups I see listed here, maybe just two or three a year. Once I get shooting anyway but also even if I cannot do that well I can say g'day and get around with like-minded people.

I gained the assumption that to do this it would be best to join ABA as most shoots, even if not too serious require Insurance and membership. Is that a necessity, ABA or did I misunderstand that? I would not join any particular club UNLESS that is an ABA requirement. It does seem that ABA requires a course to be done for membership. is that right? All need to do that course whether joining a club or not? I understand that I would have to do it at an ABA club, and Bendigo, the nearest ABA club to me, does the course for $30. I also understand I then pay for ABA membership on top. And club membership on top of that again.

Apart from supporting archery in general, I understand that getting ABA membership allows participation in the fun shoots we see here, as well as club shoots and more serious stuff. It covers members, wherever they travel with insurance on injury to and by self? And that as most clubs here on this forum at their meetups do 3D type shoots it is ABA most join rather than others?

Or have I got it all wrong about insurance and the need to join ABA or similar in order to participate in such shoots?
And the ABA Course, what is that about? Not interested in hunting really but don't mind it as an aspiration or if it is part of the Course but is it, the Course, only required for hunting licenses?

I may have it all wrong and the simple entrance fee at any shoots or meetups covers legalities such as insurance and ability to shoot/compete on the day? Whether ABA member or not?

I hope my questions are clear enough to get some definitions, I have read the ABA site and a couple of club web sites such as Chewton and Bendigo near me but often they seem badly put together, out of date or lacking in info. And I don't assimilate written stuff very well.

I know Chewton is not ABA so wouldn't join there and they are very unfriendly in my experience to trad. people with ratty old longbows anyway. I tried it twice there, they were surprisingly very rude. Bendigo is a good hour + drive away but seems to have a friendlier attitude. If I HAVE to join a club that would be it then but seems a lot of money to go just once or twice a year. That is another reason I understood I needed ABA membership, it covers me for general casual shoots and practise wherever I go at ABA clubs? So I wouldn't need to join one but if/when i get to travel I can 'call in' at ABA clubs anywhere and have a go?

It seems a shame we have to choose an affiliation to ABA or AAA or whatever, I would have hoped for a more general brotherhood of archery. But as most of the shoots I see on here that people travel to are 3D it seems ABA is the requirement.

I have joined the recent Traditional Association but it doesn't seem to extend any privileges or cover. I also intend to try a variable compound, the Bowtech Diamond Infinity Edge as it is adjustable in poundage. Yes, I have been warned against the dark-side and will wear garlic when I shoot it.

So general questions that for some reason I haven't been able to work out properly, hoping for some general explanation.

[The Hunt]

Hi, I will give it a shot, I have only been around for 18 months bu this is my take on it: to shoot at any event you do have to be a member of an archery association for insurance etc this can be ABA or 3DAAA or Archery Australia. Together there is this thing called the archery alliance,The Alliance is a co-operative arrangement between the three national archery associations of Australia see more at http://www.ausarchery.com.au/

You don't have to join a specific club. All sporting clubs have their own histories, problems ,challenges and successes. If your local club isn't for you, you don't have to be in it. But by having association membership you can come to events at other clubs or shoot at other clubs because of the archery alliance

Within the Trad scene we have now a specific association that represents us as a collective. TAA Traditional Archery Australia .It is not a governing body rather a voice, you can read more about this on the forum.
I hope that helps

PS I am a 3DAAA member , go to all the archery trad shoots and am a member of TAA and my club Hinterland Field Archers

[morganp]

: to shoot at any event you do have to be a member of an archery association for insurance etc this can be ABA or 3DAAA or Archery Australia. Together there is this thing called the archery alliance,The Alliance is a co-operative arrangement between the three national archery associations of Australia see more at http://www.ausarchery.com.au/

You don't have to join a specific club.

Great info. I had assumed the Alliance was for politicking only but it says straight up it is an umbrella for insurance and so on with shared aspirations and ideals sort of. That was my assuming making an ass out of me. Corrects also my assumption about ABA for the less formal 3D targets and shoots. 3DAAA would be the one but either will do, can take part in any as member of any. That is the way it should be I reckon, great. I can show my natural affiliation as a hunter with ABA membership but shoot in any other comps and meetups as long as the gear is right.

So I can join any of the 'big 3' and travel around and participate in any of their affiliated clubs for practice and events but needn't join a specific club. Cool.

I already joined TAAA because I think trad is coming under pressure within as well as without. It would be extra good if it acquired weight enough to join the ALLiance later.

What about the Course thing? Did you have to do one for your 3DAAA?

[wal]

This should be interesting.....

[morganp]

This should be interesting.....

How so Wal? You know something I don't obviously, care to share?

[Roadie]

I am a member of ABA, and All the shoots I have attended I have been asked to show my ABA number and its current status (financial for the current year). Some people join once and then try and attend shoots using out of date or un financial membership number or someone else identity.
I know that our shoots if you can't show current membership of one of the organisation, ABA, 3DAAA, or A/A, you don't get to shoot.
It's Simple Really you want to shoot at Various Events Join one of the Archery Organisation, then join a Club to meet like minded folk.
I know it's not every one's Cup of Tea. If you want to shoot you have to be covered by some sort of insurance, so join who ever you feel happy with.
I know some people will Totally Disagree with these comments. But being a member of ABA has allowed ME to shoot at comps, TRAD or Other in nearly every State and Territory of Aust. Cheers Roadie.

[morganp]

Thanks Roadie, hope your missus is recovering fast.
I think yours is a good answer, you need to join one or t'other to shoot. That seems simple enough.

What I still need to know then is what the 'course' is, is it obligatory, different for different associations or what?

[The Hunt]

I didnt do a course

[wal]

Mate my take on your question re the course....

I think the "course" you are referring to is the Bowhunter Proficiency Certificate (BPC). Once you become a financial Member of ABA , you must wait a mandatory two months before completing this course, the successful completion of this course then gives you insurance cover, .....in the field hunting, providing... all other members of the hunting party are current financial ABA members who have successfully completed their BPC.

Also any game harvested is permitted to claimed in to the records and comps within the organisation, should that be something you wish to participate in.

Cheers

[little arrows]

If you chose to attend only Trad shoots, you can be an independent archer, however it could be in your best interest just to join one of the associations, and that's it. However if you wish to shoot at a club near you on a regular basis then you would be best to also join that club.
The course you seem to be alluding too is perhaps as wal has suggested, bowhunters proficiency, and I do not know enough about getting one these days to comment.
So come along and have some fun.

cheers
sue

[morganp]

Thanks all. Seems consensus is to join any one of the Alliance Associations, that covers all. I can also be independent if I choose but some shoots may require membership of an (any) Association. Choice of which is mine, influenced by what the affiliation of club nearest or most suitable is or what most shoots I intend to attend are.
I will just look at the three again and join one on cost! I have no real prejudice toward or against any.
I was actually told I HAD to do the course before joining (nothing mentioned of two months), just to join ABA.
It is easy to misunderstand these requirements but I couldn't find anything anywhere that just explained it simply. I wonder how many club officials even, know the facts.

[wal]

Morgan,

You may be starting to understand my comment back up the thread a bit

First , I recommend and support joining a club and organisation, its a great way to meet folk , make some good friends and learn more about your chosen style of archery whatever it is,

Joining any club , association or organisation does not necessarily make you covered by insurance at various grounds you may travel to, it is the venue and the orgaisers of that event who are solely responsible for the insurance for that event.

For the event I have been involved in for quite a few years now, the criteria we must meet are , (note we are an ABA club), we are granted a date by the branch to hold an invitational shoot, upon that we then apply to the National executive for our shoot to be sanctioned and insured. Once we have that written approval we are set to go ahead, archers not affiliated with any of the archery alliance groups are permitted to compete upon signing the visitors register, just as a prospective member would on any club day. Without the sanctioning of national the shoot is considered uninsured, sign all the visitors books you like and plead membership of whatever you want , my understanding is you are not insured.

Those shoots not held by an ABA club are I believe generally covered by an insurance organised through a community scheme often involving a shire/council and their coverage for special events.

It is a freaking nightmare, I'm a club person and believe being part of it and putting a bit back in adds to the sport, so I would not hesitate to say go for it, but have your eyes open re insurance.

Cheers

[morganp]

Wal, I had no idea!
I have now read all the websites, spent a couple of hours on it. I a more confused and will need to re-read everything and take notes.
There is not a lot of clear information about anything let alone insurance and on one of the sites, 3DAAA even the T&C page was missing. I am quite shocked, seriously, at the amateur organisation of what should be professional bodies, certainly of the websites.

And now I see WAA appears and adds to the fun.

I am not a troll, I just tried a week or so back to get some general information and now I believe even most members would be confused or ignorant of the true situation. Should be simple.

AA want me to join them, and then AA Vic and then club. No thanks.
Starting to wonder if any of them are worth it.
I am quite intelligent but just cannot get this straight. Will try again tomorrow.

[GrahameA]

Morning Wal.

... It is a freaking nightmare, ...

Yep!

For every complex problem, there is a solution that is simple, neat, and wrong. Mencken

[rodlonq]

Morgan,

I didn't do a course to join ABA. Just filled in the forms and paid the fee.

I believe as stated earlier, the course is a bowhunters proficiency course which one has to complete if one wishes to claim game awards. If you only ever want to attend club shoots and not hunt, then you do not need to do the course.

I hope this is correct, I would not like to mislead you which is why I didn't respond earlier.

Cheers....... Rod

[dartonian]

Morgan,

Some ABA clubs will require you to do an introductory course... Kind of like an OH&S safety induction and to make sure you are competent with the bow before letting you loose on the field course. From memory, at the ABA club I'm in, its a couple of hours on the morning of a shoot and it's the club coaches call to say you are proficient enough to shoot. Not sure if its the same for all clubs and certainly not required to be a member of the association.

Hope this helps
Cheers,

[morganp]

Thanks everyone. I am waiting until I am a bit fitter then I will chase all this up again. No response from local club yet to my questions. Hopefully they are on hols or something rather than ignoring me but I didn't ring again as I have been a bit crook. So to get a full, legal understanding especially of Insurance coverage I will write to the Association rather than any one of the 3. I will get the story on what membership of one or any means in terms of insurance and various invitational meets and comps, hunting in field and travelling away etc. and ask for full clarification as I am not sure many know the reality. I have heard many variations and ideas, not just on here, and cannot be sure any are right whatever the integrity of the person offering information as sometimes it is contradictory.

I had hoped a representative of one or more of the relevant bodies would see this or my similar post on Aus Bowhunters forum. I had in fact wrongly assumed they were aware enough to actually want a presence on active forums, not just to offer official perspectives but also to obtain feedback. That of course assumes they want to know what various types of archers actually want or require ...