Orange Trad Peg at QLD ABA State Titles

[little arrows]

Hi All,

I have it on good authority that the Wide Bay club who are hosting the QLD ABA State Titles on weekend of May 4/5 2013 are implementing the Orange Trad Peg for those who are shooting longbows and recurves and TIMBER arrows - maximum distance is 30m.

If you are attending please take this opportunity to support the new peg, that is specifically now implemented for Traditional shooting, and must be shot with TIMBER arrows.
Nominations must be in by Monday 29th April.

cheers
sue

[perry]

Thanks for the Heads up Sue.

I hope this comes across in a positive light as I want Archers to continue to improve their Skills and not limit themselves. I am really passionate about Archery, the Traditional Skills and Shooting Traditional Bows.

I really don't understand this Move other than ABA is trying to attract Archers back - why is it we could shoot our Flatbows, Recurves etc in the 70's, 80's and 90's at ABA Shoots up to the 52 Yards Series 5 Max and reliably hit the Targets ???? They have grades so that one is competing against others of like ability.

I know People will say they have no interest in shooting longer Ranges but it's not about that - it's about improving your ability with a Bow. Trad Bow Shooters that Hunt or even if they have no interest in anything but Trad Shoots need to understand that if they can reliably hit a Series 5 Target on an ABA Field Round they will shoot much better at much touted Hunting Ranges and up to the 30 Yard Max at Trad Shoots.

I often hear Folks saying I only shoot 20 yards Max when I hunt so I can be sure I can place my Shot, well if you practiced to 50 or 60 Yards occasionly and could improve your Skills to the point where you can reliably hit the Target, not in the Centre but a respectable group how much more SURE would you be in placing your Shot in the Bush or on the Field Coarse at 20 Yards

Unless todays Crop of Trad Archers challenge themselves and improve there Game they will not be as Skillfull as previous Generations of Archers - Trad Archery is being dumbed down. Little exposes ones short comings as an Archer more than a long shoot. Archery is a difficult pursuit, Folks at Trad events smash Arrows left right and centre even at these Short Ranges, you will break many less Arrows at Trad Events if your Form is such that you can shoot consistently at longer Range

If you are going to ABA shoots it's likely you are shooting for a Score, many come to Trad Shoots and whether they admit it or not want to Shoot well. Consider this, your Score does not matter, what matters is the % of good Shots, a high percentage of good shoots will result in a higher Score. Having the ability to shoot consistently at longer Ranges indicates a greater % of good Shots due to improved consistency. A good Shot is a result of good Form. You can shoot a 10 with lousy Form, even take Game but then it's just luck. Give me Good Consistent Form over good Luck.

I'm like most other Folks, struggle for the time to go an practice but today when I do get to the Range I'll spend 10 or 15 minutes shooting for Form, then I am going to spend 10 or 15 minutes shooting at various 40, 50, 60 and maybe the odd 70 yard Target to reinforce this

It's much more fun pulling Arrows out of the Target than Shattering them on a Tree or Rock, except perhaps for your Shooting Mates

regards Jacko

[rodlonq]

Thats interesting Sue, thanks for letting us know.

Thanks for your response Perry. I am one of those that hunts inside 20 m and I really struggle to hit the 48 m targets on an ABA round. I don't go to shoots very often as I like my tinkering in the shed a lot more (when I finish the laundry this morning I am going to lay up a bow). When I do practice my maximum range is limited to 15 m so thats all I feel comfortable with. Your response has encouraged me to at least try to practice some longer range shots. I cant imagine how my 13+ grains per pounds arras will fly at 60 m (bit like a mortar I assume) but it cant hurt to try.

Cheers........ Rod

[GrahameA]

Hi Perry

... I know People will say they have no interest in shooting longer Ranges but it's not about that ...

Shooting at longer distances is all part of Archery. However, if longer ranges are used then I would suggest that the "target" setup should match the distance and address the issues. As the distance increases the arrows suffer move from drag and time of flight, as the distance increases the increases small errors give large variation in flight and more misses. So if people want to shoot longer distances then they would benefit from less fletching and larger targets/backstops ... and a bit of appropriate practice.

[Fraser]

I have mixed emotions about this, I have a love/hate relationship with the longer shots. When I sneak out to the range by my self I quite happily empty my quiver at the series 5 targets, but on a shoot I get quite frustrated with the fact that I'm probably going to walk away with 4 points for the target.

Fraser

[Trad Bound]

Lets debate Timber arrows again, it must be a few hours since that came up.
I for one are happy to shoot 30m, yes I enjoy the longer distance but 30m is just fine. We are trying to encourage a Trad peg out our shoots and I would support this move.
Hey Sue, what is a timber arrow?????

[perry]

Rod my Arrows are between 12 and 13 grains per pound, they drop like stones and it most certainly is character building shooting them at longer Range but it's a challenge that I think is worth it. Shoulders no good so am limited to 45# and even then 50 or 60 Arrows and I'm done. It is very tempting to take the easy option and shoot light Arrows but I don't like Easy. I'll keep shooting the same weight Arrows at Targets or Hunting

If ABA gets back a few shooters with the Orange Peg, thats good for them but there is more to getting back those Ex ABA Trad Shooters than moving them closer

OK I'll Bite - ABA already caters for Carbons, -Modern Longbow / Recurve Divisions. Quite proud of the Fact that ABA took some of the Definitions/Rules that where and still are discussed at such length and written by Ozbow members and adapted them to their Disipline.

regards Jacko

[DavidM]

Hi Perry

Just finished an IFAA shoot today, maximum shot 80 yards. I might be a sick puppy but I really enjoy the long shots. I’m not saying i hit them frequently but I enjoy shooting them.

[little arrows]

Hey Perry,

Don't they call that clout - maybe they could put in a Perry Peg.

cheers
sue

[Roadie]

Nah Sue , Clout is when you beat some one around the Ears, to get their Attention. Cheers Roadie.

[little arrows]

oh that's right Roadie, sorry I got confused ..................... again.....

drinks anyone?

cheers
sue

[Fraser]

It's a catch 22, 30m shoots make your scores more competitive, but a 1A at 48m is a good felling.

I thought a clout was a type of nail!

Fraser

[Scrub Bull]

Clout (band), a five-piece South African million-selling all-girl rock group formed in 1977.

[perry]

Perhaps I need to limit my Posts, many of you will Ruin your Health if my Posts Drive you to Drink

Grahame one or 2 Targets, perhaps a Double or nothing option on one or 2 Targets at a Trad Shoot, this does not require equipment as you describe. This would serve to challenge Folks to improve their consistency. Even a 52 Yard ABA Shot with 12 or 13 Grain per # Arrows as many Trad Shooters shoot simply requires one to Point them Higher. Herresy - develop a Gap, no equipment change needed , broaden ones Skillset

IFAA is a tremendous Disipline. Have not shot a round in Years but most of the money shots are in the 35 - 55 Yard area, there is only one Target at 80 Yards. When ABA introduced it back in the 80's it was very controversal, never understood the Noise back then either

Bear with me -- long winded story pruned down

"A DUMBED DOWN" Selfbow shooter had a Spit at me because of a too long and too hard shot at the Caboolture Shoot.

I prunned a stand of Lantana so the top was flat, the shooter stood in a slight depression in the ground, I even set it up so shorter people had a clear uninterupted View.

Mackenzie Blackbuck slightly uphill just shy of "20 YARDS" placed so the Lantana appeared level with the Targets Belly, it was several Yards behind it. Affect - the narrow target and table top Lantana made the Shot look further.

Truth was this Bloke blamed a lack of Skill with the Bow and Range estimation on ME, the Coarse setter. He had no structured practice regeime and wanted short unchallenging Targets so he could feel good about his abilities

Improving consistency at longer Range will help you in all manor of Ways including Judging Range. ABA adding a Trad Peg won't make People that play the Game a better shot even though they may feel better about their abilities

regards Jacko

[GrahameA]

Hi All.

Looking at things from a Brisbane centric viewpoint. People in other Sates will need to look at what is available in their area.

On the weekend I dropped into the SQAS Target event. There were a number of people shooting Barebow Recurves and Longbows at 50+ metre distances. This was an Alliance event so anyone who is a member of AA/ABA/3DAA could have shot it. Later in the year SQAS will run their Field Event (and it will probably be marked field), once again there will be a number of opportunities to shoot longer distances. If people really want to shoot longer distances then the SQAS Clout event is coming up later in the year.

If people want to shoot longer distances the opportunities are there if they want to take advantage of them.

Trad shoots have settled into a pattern/agreement of a maximum 30 yard shot. For me it is all good. It appears on the surface to appeal to the majority of people who attend. IMHO People prefer shorter distances.

Within the broader scope of Archery there is something to suit the majority of tastes.

[wal]

Orange trad peg..............wasn't supported in our area at all, was regarded by most that it was an insinuation that the gear was inferior, inefficient and the archer lacking, some thought it should have been a pink peg.

Your division is your division and you compete against those within that division, regardless of distance, the top shots still shine.

[wishsong]

Your division is your division and you compete against those within that division, regardless of distance, the top shots still shine.

Orange trad peg..............wasn't supported in our area at all, was regarded by most that it was an insinuation that the gear was inferior, inefficient and the archer lacking, some thought it should have been a pink peg.

Your division is your division and you compete against those within that division, regardless of distance, the top shots still shine.

Well said .

shooting well at 30 yards is hard , shooting well at longer distances even harder ... but still attainable , as shown by many of the Scores shot in NFAA etc round pre compound .

As others have said before , don't like the rules , start your own shoot or attend one that better suits your needs and wants ... note I did not say abilities .

It is a dumbing down of the sport IMHO , and for those who are genuinely competitive , it is not at all helpful .

I'll , when I am able to actually get there continue to shoot form the grown up pegs , and take my lumps regardless of distance and or equipment .

Beside , shooting a good score with a flat laid , Hill style longbow and wooden arrows amidst all comers is my goal .

[longbowinfected]

Plenty of opportunities shooting longer distances with longbow in AA even if you want to shoot with woods.
I am not an ABA member but think that it is a good thing wrt orange peg...a good effort to include trad shooters. Some may choose to go on and shoot longer distances.

I find that maintaining form really requires shooting a thousand arrows a week and you really need to practice each distance. Big trick when going longer is to keep staring at your aiming point until you hear the arrow hit....try to avoid lifting your head to see what happened as you drop your bow arm early if you do look up.

Love shooting a FITA 60 or double Canberra.

Kevin

[GrahameA]

Hi Kevin.

Plenty of opportunities shooting longer distances with longbow in AA even if you want to shoot with woods.
I am not an ABA member but think that it is a good thing wrt orange peg...a good effort to include trad shooters. Some may choose to go on and shoot longer distances.

In essence I agree. If people want to shoot longer distance there are plenty of opportunities. It is the same story - if you want it, it is available.

I am pleased that ABA has gone with a new peg and a shorter distance for wood arrows. It just fits in with the complete 'thing'.

[Ronster]

Hi all, I shoot with an ABA club:-The Darling Downs Field Archers, and they give Trad shooters the choice, which is really good! I am a target archer and so not a big deal for me, as I prefer modern recurve anyway. However just to throw an opinion out there. If I were a hunter I would not be shooting arrows with the hope of hitting the Animal but would want to have the 1st arrow a kill arrow and would want to get as close as possible to ensure that kill. For that reason alone, a Trad peg is good.


PS

Nah Sue , Clout is when you beat some one around the Ears, to get their Attention. Cheers Roadie.

Hey Grant there is some Caveman in you too eh

Ronster

[hutcho]

Orange trad peg..............wasn't supported in our area at all, was regarded by most that it was an insinuation that the gear was inferior, inefficient and the archer lacking, some thought it should have been a pink peg.

Your division is your division and you compete against those within that division, regardless of distance, the top shots still shine.

I remember shooting a round of orange "hunter" peg that ABA trialled a few years ago. the RO set most of the orange pegs right in the middle of the mown cleared eight foot shooting lane. some people commented (that didn't shoot the orange) that there was no need for the orange as with the modern bows 60 metre shots were safe and efficient. that started a robust discussion later that night.

As a side note, instead of shooting from the orange peg we moved (where safe) to the closest realistic hunting shot level with or behind the orange and had a hoot.

[little arrows]

Why do I bother.!!!!

[Ronster]

Why do I bother.!!!!

Sue its because you care.! Dont Change

Ronster

[littlejohn59]

Why do I bother.!!!!

Sue its because you care.! Dont Change

Ronster

I don't know either.

[perry]

Sue, you done good letting People know about the Shoot and the Orange Peg.

People aren't being contrary, Folks have their own Mind thats all !

regards Jacko

[longbowinfected]

Sue, because of your info I am more likely to go to a few ABA shoots. Shooting long distance does not worry me except that it does not reflect the distances I would shoot at if hunting or demonstrate respect for the animals being hunted by longbow archers. Good news story. I hope it gets supported. I intend to visit Lithgow and have a go.

Kevin

[dan76]

I nominated for the state titles this weekend and will be shooting wood arrows from the orange, I will let you know if at the end of weekend I feel dumbed down at all. The only reason i am shooting this weekend is practice for Barambah The distances being much the same i can work on form and focus.

[slinkymalinky]

Sue,

You bother because you love trad archery and you get a buzz out of seeing other people (like me) get excited about it, go on the trad journey, and enjoy it.

Nothing is more of a buzz-kill to me in relation to shooting my trad gear, than people being judgemental about the merits of one kind of shooting over another. Nothing personal to those who made the comments but to say that shooting shorter distances is 'dumbing down' trad archery is, by implication, a view that one kind of trad archery is more worthy than another.

I think it's great that different people enjoy different kinds of archery. Some people love honing their skills with long shooting, other people get their smiles from hitting a few targets from 15m.... some people just like collecting the wood and leather. Good on all of them... whatever lights your candle.

We should be more concerned to pass on our love of trad archery so that new people keep finding out how much fun it is. So when we hear about initiatives like the orange peg, it's viewed as just another way that some people will find trad archery enjoyable. Sure, it might not be some people's cup of tea, so don't shoot off the orange peg!

I sometimes feel that the feeling of camaraderie, fun, laughter, sharing and generosity that is everywhere at trad get-together events, evaporates on-line. It seems regularly to turn into a snipey, snobby, pedantic environment that makes me want to go and shoot my compound bow. I don't expect everyone to suddenly agree on everything but I really hate anyone being treated like they're an idiot or inferior because they have a different view...

If we want trad archery to flourish, then we should all make it welcoming and help everyone find their own way to enjoy it. I don't mean make every event a free for all... but allow the people who choose to shoot short range events and those who shoot long targets and those who shoot wood arrows and those who shoot carbon arrows etc etc etc, to enjoy their choice. There's lots of options and events for trad shooters of all persuasions to enjoy.


Sue... thanks for the info on the orange peg for wood arrow trad shooters. Love your passion for trad!

Rant done... Tony

[toby]

Slinky I agree on almost everything you say, except I haven't owned a wheelie bow in years & could never see myself shooting one again. You just need to ignore the people & comments that you disagree with. I like the idea of the orange peg but see merit in the longer shots as well. If I was to sum up opinion it would be that I don't mind shooting at 40 or 50 yards but I don't like breaking or loosing any more arrows than I have to. I know people will say then just don't miss the target but this is alot harder to do at 50 yards & I don't get the time to practise as much as I would like. Sue hang in there I think your the glue that holds all of us together when we start to fracture with our differences of opinion.

[scuzz]

Dont worry Sue, there is a fair amount of differing opinions from topic to topic on here. But this is what forums are for, seeing others opinions, comparing them to your own, and making a personal choice as to whether they have any merit.

I can see both sides of this discussion (and a discussion it is, not an argument). Sure, if you want to hone your skills then shoot at longer distances. I know when i practice i dont shoot below 30meters because your faults in consistancy are exaggerated at longer distances. In addition you can get better tuning of your equipment. Yesterday i was shooting from 30m and i found one spine of arrow was hitting noticeably closer than the weaker, well one set had a footed end so maybe it was the FTC, this is something i will be experimenting with. So there is alot of merits of shooting longer distances, and for me, striving to better my accuracy and equipment is enjoyable, and a great sense of accomplishment once a new plateau is reached.

Having said all of that, if your not confident at longer distances then you shouldnt have to shoot such. And as toby said, loosing/breaking arrows is a pain in the neck. If you put as much effort into making arrows as i do, then losing them at a distance your not comfortable with will only lessen your passion. Also i think children and woman seem to struggle with the longer distances, projectory of the arrows seem to be less flat possible from the lighter weight, shorter draw lengths. But this is only an observation, im not entirely sure if it can be overcome with lighter arrows or not.

So overall this orange peg is likely a good development for Trad, it gives an option for people still developing their skills, and by doing this hopefully creates a larger family of trad.

Just me 2cents
Scuzz