Who's the Modern Superpower

[stickshooter]

How much trouble are they in when the US Senate call in a preist to help them solve their political problems.
BRING BACK MICKEY MOUSE
nigel

[piggy]

What gets me is they can't repay their debt now so they borrow more to cover their debt payments and hope they can cut costs to reduce their debt. The interest is the killer, how long can this go on for? When in the US in January I amazed to hear that in some states the interest only on their debt is greater than the earnings of the state let alone paying anything off the capital.

[bigbob]

Dont worry the Sunday Mail has Qld's debt at $60 billion and climbing! What a wonderful Government we have.

[Nephew]

I read that China holds over $400 Billion in US Govt. bonds! Apart from the enormous quarterly yields, imagine the chaos they could wreak by demanding THAT once they have matured!! Used strategically, they could have a unbelievable impact on Western Civilisation! They could hold on to 'em, then demand payment at the "right" time, which would be when the US is at it's most financially vulnerable...say a short window of opportunity just after Congress fails to agree on temporarily raising the debt ceiling while also allowing the closure of certain loopholes that encourage the rich to get away with avoiding their responsibilities regarding taxes and other methods of raising revenue at this vital time.
Very worrying times. It amazes me that the European Union is bailing out places like Greece ( and yes, Greece defaulting on all Govt. debt would have catastrophic consequences, but not nearly as bad as the US defaulting!) when surely it's in their best interests to assist in whatever way needed to keep the US solvent and able to counter balance Chinas power and influence?
For those (and I have been one of them at times in my life) that have a instinctive, gut reaction of hating all things American and the ubiquitous presence of American cultural influence...just wait until the Chinese are running the show!
Equally, for those Americans that have an instinctive dislike of all taxes and seem to always want further tax cuts and further cuts in Govt. spending (unless, of course they are a banker needing a bail-out. Then, suddenly, they are true believing Keynesians, or even...shiver... Socialists! ) , you will have to be prepared to no longer be the most dominant political and military force Earth has ever known! You can't wield power when your Govt. has no financial resources with which to wield, fellas! In fact, you'll have no power to wield in any case! I have no love for any kind of tax, but they are simply a necessity for running any functioning society. In the last thirty or so years there has been been a development of a certain kind of almost religious belief amongst some conservative ,"economic rationalist" politicians (what's so "rational" about closing down industry and sending all those blue collar jobs overseas?) that ALL taxes are forged by Satan himself and that they can somehow run a world super-power without them...or a Govt for that matter, in any recognisable sense of the term! "Private Enterprise will save the day!" they bleat, yet encourage a no regulations, no taxes mentality that eventually erodes all sense of social responsibility and ensures private enterprise will exploit any situation, given the opportunity to do so, and take as much profit while giving as little product as possible. If that means you rip people off, be it client or employee, then all the better...more profits! Not exactly a climate conducive for patriotic altruism, hey? Private Enterprise, of the massive, impersonal corporation type we would be talking about here, will save nothing but it's own ill-gotten gains.

As much as they may like to hear themselves promote the ideas of Individualism and Freedom at ANY cost , it seems to me that by taking those fine and reasonable motivations to the unreasonable extreme, these guys have become complicit in their own oppression...and, if things go the way it looks they might, ours too, in the not to distant future.
I hope your kids are learning Mandarin, Fellas.

[slvrslngr]

I think this is a good lesson for those who think that living on credit and beyond their means is a good idea. This issue has been building for the last 30 years or so as the banks have pushed credit cards and easy house, car and personal loans on people who have gotten lazier and greedier every year. Yes, this coming from an American. I'm disgusted with my Government at the moment and the people that defend the banks and financial institutions that have brought my country to the brink of bankruptcy. Lots of people to blame here, not that pointing the finger will do any good. We need to get our troops out of the middle east, stop being the worlds policemen, and the citizens need to stop whining, tighten the belts, and bring manufacturing back to the US. The government needs to have more oversight with the banks and financial companies as well. There is so much that needs to happen it's pretty overwhelming. Things are going to get worse before they get better. I'll be heading back Stateside in a year or so and have serious concerns about what I'll be going back to.

[TomMcDonald]

Good ol' growth economics ha!

[SouthTexasPighunter]

Unfortunately whats said is very true. The old adage the rich get richer is true. Unfair business tactics are now the norm from home lending to petroleum and everywhere in between, food, clothing, basic things are now outsourced to other countries instead of kept in house to take care of our own. Business is no longer a handshake and a promise its who can make the most, shady deal or not. That being said like I have said before, MANY love to hate the U.S., BUT if they see they can make money off of the States they will. Maybe not in the short term but long term where yesterday and todays children have to pay for it. I'm not ashamed to say it I was born and bred in the Southern U.S. my people have been there from the beginning. I have bled for her and many of my brethren have died for it, some in my arms. We are judged by the actions of our leaders and those who hold media ties and become the unofficial spokesmen for us. The U.S. people are like any other people in any other country, some good, some not so good , some down right pathetic. Big industry is another demon altogether. U.S. influence is simply that influence the final say is with the individual as to whether you allow yourself to be influenced. Whether positive or negative influence is put out an individual has the mind to say No I will not be swayed or Sure I'm game. Now I am not an educated man I never went to college, univeristy or any type of higher learning institution. I'm as I have said before a man of the earth. I've worked the soil for crops worked cattle on horseback, worked in the oilfields as a rough neck as have most of the men and some women in my family. We have been hunters, gatherrers, farmers, Warriors with very few that have really been educated "Formally", But we all have made choices to do or not due because of influence and no one made it for them/us. The phrase "To thine own self be true" comes to my mind because I can tell when a fello is taking a "Duny" trip on my boots and tellin me its rain formally educated or not. If you want to dislike all things American that is your freedom to do so I cannot force anyone to like or dislikeme and my own. But I would ask that you not generalize me with the leeches and Shysters who profit off of the sweat blood and pain of the folks who do as much as they can for their country and families. If it sounds like I have taken this personally, well to an extent I have. I have because just like you I breath work bleed aworry and stress over ugliness that I see evry single day. Empty promises by politicians who seek to line their pockets with silver and gold do this because I and many others before me made it possible through bloodshed. You should know Aussies were in Vietnam working side by side with Americans as well as other conflicts where blood was spilled by many side allies and enemies alike. Hate envy anger pride they all run amuck in this world. I will tell you something the way I was raised you Never denied anyone a meal a drink of water or a hand I live this way todayand although all of thistopic coverage frustratres me I would still offer anyone here the same that I described. But would you? This is my American way and whether you like me or not is irrelevent, I will not change, I'm no internet commando who runs his gob behind a screen(nor am I implying that anyone else here is) with me what you see is what you get plain and simple > I do not care for hate and as God put Breath into me I am man enough to put it out. Respect and be respected. I have said it all before. I know their are Aussies who dont like me because of where I'm from as well as many many others, but Dont throw stones at glass houses if you live in one also. Now if I upset any of you with my reply to this post and you feel you have been disrespected I apologize and if I am banned from this sight , as interesting and nice as it is then so be it. But their are Americans who seek to learn and enjoy from what you have to offer from this place. I know its your house I'm not going to stay and make waves but I also will stand up formyself.
"To thine own self be true"
Respectfully
STP

[TomMcDonald]

STP, thanks for the reply.

I think I can speak for most on this site when I say we're not commenting on the people of the nation, but the people who hold the wealth and the power.

Tom.

[Nephew]

Yeah, as Tom said, STPH, I was in no way deriding the ordinary American, I was specifically speaking of the political class, that like here and all over the Western World seem in the last 30 years to have decided their job is to protect Big Money, not the best interests of their citizens. I believe that, on balance, America has been a force for good and the last 100 years would have had a very different narrative had the U.S. not been in existence. It's this that I fear losing should the current crisis cascade into full blown catastrophe on a world wide scale. It's not just the economics, but the idea of a world where the U.S. can no longer afford to have the level of influence they have had since the end of WW2. What I was saying is that if folk don't like that influence, then they are in for a big shock once it's gone and we have to deal with the only viable alternative...China have global hegemony... a very sobering thought, hey?

As you say, and I have said to you in a P.M., most ordinary Americans I have met are just every day folk trying to get on with their lives with as little trouble and fuss as possible, an admirable approach to life shared by most ordinary people in the world I would imagine.

The drive to exploit a normal aversion to taxes that all folk everywhere have has lead to a situation where there just isn't the money to continue with the status quo. Add to that the "small govt." push of conservatives of all nations and there is only one logical outcome. The West will eventually become the poor cousins of the world. It happens here too, but the stakes are not as high as they are when discussing the U.S., that's all. I hope I have cleared up any perceived ill will, it was certainly not my intention to give you that impression.
I did confess to holding these kind of one dimensional, not really all that well thought through, anti U.S. views at times in my life, but it was long ago (1980's-90's) and we all get a few "dopey mistakes of youth" free kicks, don't we?

[stickshooter]

we are slowly digging our way out of a recession
I'v put my house in order(overdraft dealt with creditors paid),
All in the RECESSION,
WHEN WILL THE GOVT'S of the first world stop wasting money on lazy daydreamy rubbish just to keep the lazy on welfare instead of taking the line that is needed to get the books in order.
We all for sure going to have to speak a new language so we can obey our new masters.
My post was not a dig at the man on the street as you have no more influence over the GOVT than myself over the Kiwi Govt

But I have to say I couldn't stop myself from laughing all day.

AND THESE GUY'S HAVE NUKES

P.S they have now come to an agreement so we can watch the show again next year
cheers
Nigel

[Nephew]

I agree, although I'm more concerned with what "The Power" spends on THEMSELVES than welfare recipients. Very good points, though.

[SouthTexasPighunter]

Good afternoon, well here anyway I do want to apologize for my rant yesterday. I am simply just fed up with negativity.... everywhere. Unfortunately what I feel(and others) do not mean a hill of beans to those in power here in the states or any else where in the world. Sons, brothers, fathers, daughters, mothers and so on and so forth are still dieing, being maimed, starved and barely make it through their lives, while corporations and Governments get fat of the sweat and blood of those good people, period. It doesnt matter where you are from, working class is working class and upper class is still upper class(but NOt necessariy better). I dont fault or hold it against a person if they have money..... everyone would like to have more of it. But dont cut anothers throat or throw others to the wolves to get it like "BIG BROTHER" does behind closed doors and in dark settings. I personaly would not make a good politician because I say what I feel and I'd probably wouldnt make many friends there either. I vote for the person who I feel would do me and my people better service and not with one party or another just because that party is for the poor or rich. If your good your good and if not take a walk. I really like it here it seems to be a good crowd who sharea common liking for Stickbows and Traditional ways, something I personally feel the world nees to get back to, Traditional living. We live in a modern world though and that probably will not happen unless there is a crash on a global level. But with all the modern niceties we must all remember that they are tools and just tools. Not the answer to everything. Unfortunately those corrupt and deviuous use these same tools we utilize to do dirty things and we all pay for it in some way. Once again I apologize to all now lets get a pint of the dark stuff.
STP

[GrahameA]

Morning All.

This, in my view is a more rational view of things:

..... There is a foolish tendency among non-US commentators, and too many Americans as well, to regard the US system, because of its many checks and balances, as incoherent and dysfunctional.

But this episode is one where the US demonstrates the at least occasional superiority of its governing model to that of a parliamentary system.

A Westminster government that enjoyed majority support for the executive in parliament would have just raised its debt level, and kept doing so until it reached the logical end point of Greece: insolvency. That, unfortunately, seems to be the policy instinct of the Obama administration.

But the US system, with its two-yearly congressional cycle, forced debt reduction and the danger of the ballooning deficit to the centre of the debate. .....

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/wo ... 6106212199

[TomMcDonald]

The welfare system. Stopping us become America since 1901!

[Rock Steady]

The old adage the rich get richer is true. Unfair business tactics are now the norm from home lending to petroleum and everywhere in between, food, clothing, basic things are now outsourced to other countries instead of kept in house to take care of our own

Strangely enough we are discussing on another thread about buying overseas broadheads because they are a couple of dollars cheaper instead of supporting the home grown ones.

So are we part of the problem?

[stickshooter]

yes we all are rocky,always looking at ways to save a buck.
I'v alway's said that because we all go for the cheapest "made in China" products,try buying clothing not made in China,
then we will bring our standard of living down to the same as their's.
We can't compete price wise as long as we pay our workers more than a $1 per hour,so to keep our standard of living we should alway's buy products made in our own county.
But then again we are all in a Global Economey
nigel