Knife steel-D2

[DylanK]

Im planning to start making a heavy duty hunting bowie knife and had a look at knife making supplies and they sell D2 steel. For about $40 TMD, I could get 35cm about 5mm thick D2 steel. I have looked everywhere around my area for steel but everyone sells mild stuff. Knife making supplies also have got pre cut blanks in 440C stainless steel. My question is; Would D2 snap on me when chopping wood, bone etc, and would the edge hold well. I will probably send it to hills tempering for a professional quenching/tempering job. Or would the stainless steel be better? It costs more for the 440c blanks then the D2.

As i stated before, i have looked for 5160, and 1095 and no one sells it that i can find. I would also be happy with other steels if it would suit my needs. I have read that D2 is a good steel that dont rust as bad as other metals.

Dylan

[kimall]

Mate how bigger piece are you after I may be able to help you.Also with will it be tuff enough that may depend on design and the hardening process but if it is done professionaly you should be right.I like the 1095 as I can soften it and then reharden it myself which makes it cheaper and easier.
Cheers KIM

[jape]

Have you tried Keith at AKC fro D2 and stainless? http://www.knivesaustralia.com.au/steel.html#D2
He can probably source other stock.

5160 and 1095 used to be known as 'spring steel' and 'file steel' so an alternative place to start is in scrap yards and good ones will know what you want and help you out. Usually free if you chat enough or at least a darn site cheaper than blanks from $70 to $700 a metre ...
Some 'old bloke down the back' will have worked steel and have good tips I am sure!

I haven't made anything for decades so don't want to sound like a 'know it all', as I am a pretty poor blademaker, just played around for myself and mates but if you are starting from blanks and grinding out then D2 is fine but I don't know why people want it, sure it is a good edge but harder to sharpen (use a diamond sharpener in the field) and not that much better than 1095 at rust proofing. It takes a lot more and more expensive abrasives and materials in working up too! I have chopped through bone with it but that is as much to do with blade shape, thickness and style as anything. I just used to coat all my blades with beeswax and the sheaths with neatsfoot and that was fine. Everyone has their own favourite methods though. Just regular oiling is enough usually.

Nothing better than getting spring steel and forging and cutting it yourself, you can do that easily enough with coke or charcoal in an old wheel rim from a truck, with a 12v car fan for air, an old bit of rail line for an anvil and a drum for oil or water. Then you have control of tempering too and THAT is where you get your skill and find the final hardness and resilience of your blade. Have fun!

[DylanK]

Thanks for the replys fellas. I want the blade to be 8 1/2 inch long. Handle im yet to work out. I want the knife to hold its edge well as cutting wood and all that dulls normal blades fairly quickly (440c). I would love to try and aneall and temper and harder all my self, but as long as the end result is acceptable.

I have been to all the metal suppliers around my area and no one sells high carbon steel. If i was going to use 1095 or 5160 i would heat/temper it myself but with D2 i would send it to a proff like i said before.

Jape the quote for the D2 is off that website you posted

I went to my hardware store and they sell cheap dodgy looking files that arnt even close to the size i want.

Dylan

[jindydiver]

Where do you live? I can send you a piece of 5160 (50mm x 5mm). I was given some and I am sure I can spare enough for one knife

[jape]

I have a mate who knows all this stuff inside out and in fact over time he told me most of what I passed on to you! I would say if you are going D2 then it is better for thinner small blades - D2 is good for cutting bone but not so good for chopping bone and as you are going 81/2 inches and want to chop you would be better with 1095.
I have worked that at sword length. Try some old files from a local market or somewhere like that.

[DylanK]

I live in brisbane jindy. Thanks for your offer but its a bit short. Im going to the markets tomoro ill see if i can find and old file.

Well i guess 1095 is the steel i should be looking for? Whats the difference between 1095 and 5160?

Dylan

[Stewart Townsend]

Have a look at this site
http://laventrix.net/

Someone had a link about steel and it's "other names" for example O-1, Silver Steel and Precision Ground are the same thing for one company depending if it was big or round bar.

try http://laventrix.net/showthread.php?t=1386

5mm D2 would be fine for a "heavy duty hunting bowie knife" with a flat, convex or sabre grind.

[jape]

I tend to look at things from a practical and cost basis rather than a technical viewpoint, and the fine print of how much carbon, nickel, moly etc. is best is a bit beyond me. And I have found good steel useless to sharpen after I have worked it and rough old stuff from the back of the shed like old tool steel has come up OK! So if a knife maker says D2 is good for a bowie I ain't gonna argue! Especially if you are carefully (and expensively) removing stock rather than forging and bashing the metal.

I don't know the technical difference between spring steel and file steel but in my view it would be as much about heat treatment and tempering point for us novices mucking about in the shed, as it is about carbon content or degree of stainless additives. I have made good working blades from car springs, an old garden spade and from old worn-out files, and also from industrial hacksaw blades. And once a small machete from an old broad-axe.

However, if D2 and 440B or C are what people are using, it must be popular for a reason and it is available. I would still take a trip to a scrap yard though, much more fun than just typing in your credit card details! One bloke I know locally, a saw-miller with his own spot mill, makes blades of all sorts from old sawmill saw-blades. I have seen him chop through a thick chain with one. He laughs at my bow as he also makes mortars and cannons for fun and is currently surveying the local forest with a directional microphone and infra-red beams to catch a wild puma. He also eats road-kill. Takes all sorts eh? There are some amazing characters out in the bush.

[nimrod]

jape YOU dont eat roadkill some of my best meals have been found this way chasing pumas god loves a trier you know some interesting guys mate check out british blades forum google you will see some ARTISTS there wish I had 1/2 there skills do you guys use catapaults at all for hunting ?? cheers

[Stewart Townsend]

Jape,

What you are saying is correct.

My belief is that a lot of guys want to make a knife. One problem is they don't have much equipment and tools. Certainly I didn't have many when I started (I am not a tradie).

IMO the $40 (ish) for a piece of "known steel" is a bargain. $15 (ish) to get it professionaly heat treated and you have a knife for ever/long time. It can be frustrating trying to do your own heat treating using unknown steels.

I did miss the bit about cutting bone (see Fri Dec 05, 2008 7:21 pm ) probably typing when Jape posted it. Yeah go maybe with the 5160, 1080 or maybe 1095. The problem with knives is people want steel/knives that do everything.

[DylanK]

I dont mind oiling it and taking care of it, as long as it can hold an edge longer than 440c stainless steel. Edge retention and durability is the prioraty.

[Stewart Townsend]

as long as it can hold an edge longer than 440c stainless steel. Edge retention and durability is the prioraty.

Interesting that some of the knives I made for the kitchen and "my shed knife" are made of 440C. I have had no problems with 440C. I have factory 440A and 440B knives have been "not flash" particularly 440A for edge retention.

I normally get them heat treated to 58R and 56R for filleters. Having said the design, edge type and the geometry of the blade makes a difference. It can be a trade off.