Recycled Butchers Skinner

[perry]

G/Day folks I've had an old carbon steel curved skinning blade knife floating around my Selfbow making toolbow for years now. It had a plastic handle that had a big piece missing and the blade had a very large chip in it ,Id say from when it got dropped into a mincing machine or similar.

I have recently read in an issue of Backwoodsman Magazine where a chap wrote about boiling Antler to straighten it and to soften it enough to incert a knife tang into. The article stated that as the Antler dry's it sets the tang fast into the Antler. I thought I'd try it out.

Because of where the chip in the blade was I could not regrind it so it had a Tang that would be centered. I had to gring it so the back of the blade flowed into the Tang. The tang is 4.5" long, the Antler 5'5". I ground the last inch off the tip and reshaped it so it balanced better and a little out of the back of the blade to offset this so the upswept tip was just above the handle. The knife despite looking a little odd due to this handles and balances well. I used a farm breed cast Rusa deer antler hence why it is smooth, off white and looks like bone.

recycled knife , Antler handle.JPG (104.94 KiB) Viewed 2914 times

It worked out just fine, boiled it for about 3 hours, clamped it into a vice to straighten it a little and incerted [ read forced ] the Antler into the tang. I started it off perfectly centred but I would say that an irregularity in the Antler core forced it very slightly off centre. All and all I'm happy with the recycled knife which to me resembles a Frontier knife from the mid to late 19th century and it has set up rock solid without glue or pins.

new sheath.JPG (50.71 KiB) Viewed 2914 times

The sheath is a scrap of Vege tanned tooling leather that I have simply rubbed Olive Oil into. I have been using quality vegetable oil to protect and preserve my leather for quite a while and am perfectly happy with it. Certainly much cheaper and as effective as Neatsfoot Oil. I was surprised at how dark the flesh coloured leather went.

I would like to try the boiled Antler method again with a small diameter round tang knife where I hammer the end into a dome to assist in holding it fast instead of the flat tapered tang the damaged blade forced me to use.

A word of warning - I'm either brave, stupid or both as we live in a 2 bedroon townhouse with an attached Garage. Boiling Antler in the Garage filled the house with a smell similar to burnt feathers, The missus was not impressed.

regards Jacko

[Nephew]

I was surprised to find that when I boiled out a billies head the horns became soft right at the end where they joined the skull and thought maybe I had ruined them when I gently pulled them off the bone! Glad to see how well it worked out for you, Perry and I intend having a go at this myself once I get my hands on some antler.

[Stickbow Hunter]

Interesting process and a good way to make use of the damaged blade.

Jeff

[g_r]

good to know how its done.
Love the look of the knife now.

[Bill]

Thats the way perry, another job done well.

[perry]

Thanks fella's I am drawn to old fashioned hunting implements and already have my next project planned. I have in mind making a Nessmuk Knife which is somewhat similar to this knife. I will be using a power hacksaw blade and making a Neck Knife version of it. I have a quite thick set of Rusa Antlers that I should be able to cut good knife scales. I am going to have to heatreat the Hacksaw blade in order to work it properly and throughout the project I can hear the missus whinging about the noise and smell I also have an old Farriers rasp that eventually will make 2 very solid Knives, again styled after this.

Nessmuk Knife.jpg (18.15 KiB) Viewed 2813 times

regards Jacko

[jindydiver]

Love your work Perry

On heat treating a power hacksaw blade...

The majority of blades available are made from a form of High Speed Steel and you will not be able to soften them significantly, at least they will not become annealed and soft (and as easily worked) like a simple carbon steel. You can anneal them in a fire easy enough but the steel while becoming more tough and less brittle, does not become soft enough for you to be able to drill or file it (at least not easily).
This is not to say you can't make great knives out of them, you just have to think laterally and find ways to work them with abrasives. A plus is that you can work them as hard as you like and don't care one jot how hot you get them, they will still stay as hard as any commercial boning knife.

To demonstrate how flexible a bit of heat can make these knives, while still staying too hard to drill.

[perry]

Thankyou for the advice jindydiver. I was not aware the steel in power hacksaw blades would not soften to be able to drill or file more easily. No worries, one another power hacksaw blade knife I made some years ago and did not heat treat I ground a slit along the handle tang and then used epoxy and brazing wire as pins to secure the scales. At least it will become less brittle with heat.

regards Jacko

[Hiram]

You can make em soft enough to drill, file or cut. I just use an old hair dryer and build up a charcoal fire in a pit. Get the mound hot, and lay in your blade. Lay the blade on it's back and use the blower to it to a orange/white color. Just leave it in the fire for a while after you got it really hot. Just before the charcoal breaks up, remove the blade and lay it in a pre heated oven at 500 degrees, You may want to tap it out straight if you messed up and let the blade fall over on ti's side while in the charcoal. Leave it in the oven for a half hour gradually turning the heat down, then let it cool naturally. Do your profile work and drilling, then reverse the annealing procedure by re heating it in the charcoal fire. Have a tall can of Olive oil and a set of tongs and welders gloves on. Use the hair dryer to bring the entire blade up to and orange white and remove and plunge into the olive oil. Let it cool a little and remove and wash off in soapy water. Run a basterd file across the blade and see how easy it cuts, If the file skids off, polish the blade to a shiny finish and place on the rack in the oven at 375 for 10-15 mins, or until the blade starts to turn a little blue. Remove and do the file check again. You want it just hard enough that the file will barely cut it. IF your tempering process is overdone and you softened it too much, you'll have to re harden. A good steel is in some of the older Stihl chainsaw blades. Some of them a few years back were made from 01 STEEL. Another source is the leaf springs from 70's models of Chevy and GMC trucks. Most were made with 5061 steel.

[jindydiver]

These hacksaw blades are not simple carbon steel, they are High Speed steel and you cant anneal them in just a few hours. The process to anneal them requires a temperature controlled oven and many hours of slow cooling.

From a spec sheet on M2 HSS

Annealing
Heat to 1600F (870C), hold 2 hours, slow cool 30F (15C)/hour maximum) to 1000F (540C), then furnace or air cool.

[perry]

Very interesting fella's. One of my solutions???????? is simply to make small knives when using a power hacksaw blade, that way I'm not tempted to lever with them or smash out pig jaws etc with the back of the blade.

I have not started on my Nessmuk replica just yet but the old farriers rasp should heat treat much easier than a power hacksaw blade. I've also been given an old clapped out machette that I intend to cut in half and make 2 camp knives from.

regards Jacko

[jindydiver]

The farriers rasp will make a fine blade, and it will be easy to work with heat treating wise(mostly they are simple carbon steels like O1). I have seen plenty of great blades forged from those rasps, just leave the rasp showing on the handle and beat down a blade and they look like real works of art. A friend made me one as a present many years ago and it got me interested in making my own